Help me fix my broken worldview plz!

[MILFandCookies]

Hey all.

I want fuckbuddies who I see on a regular basis. 2-3 girls, 5 nights-week or so. Like mini-relationships. We hang out, she sleeps over etc. Just not committed - I'm open to committing over time but not for a while, and not until a girl proves to me I'm better with her than without her.

I have this limiting belief that I can either go for sex, or go for friendship.

If I go for sex, she won't stick around.

If I act nicer, she'll stick around but I'm rolling the dice whether sex will happen or not.

I know there are so many limiting beliefs from this broken blueprint of how relationships work.

I've been super successful in getting hookups in my life, but not as successful as I'd like getting repeat customers and building something fun and close and consistent. That's what I want.

How can I build a healthy blueprint for building fun, close, intimate, consistent fuckbuddy relationships? I'm going through the motions and taking the action (cold approaching, tinder, gym gym gym etc. and will continue to improve here), but my faulty blueprint is getting in my way.

 

[DNPTHC]

In order to build a fun FWB with the girl. You need to be able to hangout and have fun with her without having sex.

She needs to be able to do the same as well.

Some girls I will hangout with and legit just chill with them because we enjoy each other’s company. I.E. not always having sex.

Hopefully that answers part of your question.

It’s certainly a tough transition to make though.

 

[Excuses]

I'd always prioritize sex with her first, like Andy said in his guide. And THEN you can do whatever you want.
Meetup with her, have sex. And then go on sightseeing, swimming, cinema or whatever you like.

Of course if you already met each other for a while, you don't always have to have sex first. Because then it's clear. So go eat some ice cream, watch a movie, go hiking or something, then bring her home, fuck and enjoy the night.

I mean FWB is literally already saying why it works because its "friends with benefits" which means, you both act like friends to each other. You do shit together, you enjoy hanging out, you text each other some memes, you text or call her whenever you want. You drop a simple "im gonna watch this new movie on netflix, come thru"

It's not always only friendzone or sex as in a ONS. You can build your plates into FWB but it takes time. In the first 2-5 meetings, I would'nt do that much with her. The focus should be the sex. And maybe a little thing like watch a movie or a show or cook together. With time, when you fucked her already a few times and you both got comfortable to each other. You can start to do more activities. Just be aware to not give her more validation without getting sex in return. If you notice she wants to spend time with you doing everything else EXCEPT sex, and sex is OFF the table at the end of the day. Then it's time to get distant with her by a lot and prioritize sex only again for a few times, so she'll get that you're not her gay buddy thats okay with listening to her bullshit and spending time with her without her needing to spread her legs.
So it's like walking on egg shells. And all plates/fwbs break after some time, it's just not avoidable. She either gets feelings for you and will keep pushing your for a LTR. Or she finds someone better, or she gets into a LTR, or something else.

You just have to buildup slowly to a FWB. After your first lay with her, hit her up again telling her you had a good time and you should do this again. Only meet her at her or your place in the next 2-5 times depending on how fast you get comfortable and easy with each other. After this time you can start doing some other activities besides sex. But you should always push for sex still after or before the activity. Otherwise she will start to think you're okay with no sex anymore or you want to push for a relationship or you turned suddenly gay lol.

 

[NotYourAverageNerd]

I have this limiting belief that I can either go for sex, or go for friendship.

If I go for sex, she won't stick around.

...

How can I build a healthy blueprint for building fun, close, intimate, consistent fuckbuddy relationships? I'm going through the motions and taking the action (cold approaching, tinder, gym gym gym etc. and will continue to improve here), but my faulty blueprint is getting in my way.

I don't have a ton of experience with actual relationships, but have gone through this sort of "first part" a couple times. All of my best friends-who-are-girls are ones that I started by sleeping with, then started to become friends with them. If I want to sleep with a girl, that's always the first thing I try to do, then work towards becomming friends.

In every case, it was with a girl who I started off by sleeping with immediately. Strangely unlike when I'm actually trying to make regular friends, I tend to give girls the impression that I'm really interested in them as people (as well as for their pussy ). I'm not "faking" it though, I really am interested in getting close to them, largely because I don't have many regular, close friends.

Thinking back on what I've done, I think the two main things are:

1) Make sure you actually LIKE this girl and don't just like the IDEA of having a friend with benefits - I probably only actually liked less than half of the girls I've stopped slept with - I broke it off with the rest pretty quickly.

2) Allow yourself to show a little bit of vulnerability relatively quickly - I do this naturally because I don't get to do it very often. Basically just be as dead-honest as possible, including, more importantly, NOT omitting things that are true rather than just not telling any lies. I don't mean use them as your therapist, just let your guard down a little bit. A couple times I've actually talked about my insecurities about women, my body, etc. plans for the future, things I get excited about, and I'll talk with them about anything they want to share too. I'll only talk about myself a little (<5 minutes, typically) because I already know about myself, I want to get to know them.

Talking about the sex that just happened is pretty good for helping them NOT feel like they're being judged, too. If you still respect her afterward, let her know in some way, that's seemed to be a theme with a couple of these girls - they're worried what you think about them. If you can allay that fear even a little, they'll be more likely to stick around. I rarely have a "serious" tone here though. One thing I really like to do is touch/rub/finger them a little bit while talking about something that happened. Not really something I plan out or anything, I just always enjoy doing it (they seem to tend to, too )

Usually I'll do this while we're cuddling afterwards, you're both sort of "primed" to connect, and I think just being naked helps a little I'll rarely ever tell the girl to leave (or sort of lightly 'indicate' that I want her to leave, either). Most of the time they'll be around for at least an hour or two after the sex (sometimes as much as 3 or 4). If you, end your dates as soon as the sex is over right now, this might be the first thing to do. You're probably more likely to naturally start doing all of this kind of stuff if you stretch out your dates after the sex a bit.

Again I'm not "strategizing" or trying to use psychological tricks or something here, I'm doing this because I actually want to have that connection with them. If you try to use these as "tricks" or "hacks" or anything, they'll see it coming a mile away and most emotionally healthy girls will be pushed away rather than getting closer. As Andy's said, you're both on the same team here.

Anyway, that's just how it's worked for me so far, I'm not really that experienced though. This also tends to happen pretty naturally for me, too, so I may be way off-base as far as what actually matters.

 

[MILFandCookies]

This all makes sense.

Thanks for the details, NotYourAverageNerd and Excuses. Super helpful.

I've been prioritizing sex, but none of the girls seem to want to stick around.
Not sure why but there's something I need to improve.

I've gotten good feedback on the sex itself, and I don't think it's just being polite. The last couple times when I incorporated the Magic Wand into sex, girls screamed and loved it. That's not faking...

And one of the girls gave me a blowjob for 15 minutes until I stopped her... that's not faking. If she didn't like the sex before that point, she'd just do a minute or two to be polite...

It could just be me subconsciously sabotaging things because of unresolved traumas from my Mom and Dad's shitty divorce, and my Mom's constant emotional abuse. I'm on the mend and healing every day, not looking for sympathy from y'all just sharing facts.

When Andy said I should focus on something consistent and not one night stands, I overcorrected and lowered my sexual forwardness. That's not what he meant, and yeah maybe it was a necessary step to find my middle ground, but as you guys say, it's not taking away sexual forwardness, it's ADDING the friendship TO the benefits.

I could add a more vulnerability, and be more caring as an attitude. Plus keep talking on these forums about my parents' divorce so I can dissolve my emotional blocks to creating connection with the girls I sleep with.

Takeaways:
I like that phrase... "Adding friendship/connection TO THE SEX." Might be the key to healing this worldview gap and creating a positive blueprint to focus on when I hit on girls.

My plan is to take what I was doing that got girls into my bed, and ADD curiosity about them as people, and ADD vulnerability about myself. I also have been needy over text - if she didn't reply, I might double text. Or I'd be overly verbose. Or I'd leave the ball in her court, but then a week later go back on it and initiate text again. So another thing I need to do is embrace the numbers game 100% rather than just 80%.

 

[Aloofus]

joe_ronimo
What's your lead up to sex look like?

You might be inadvertantly screening IN ONS types of girls. I think Andy's template does polarize for that.

It might also be your immediate follow up too. I had a string of girls that I slept with, but wasn't able to convert to regular FWBs. A big part of that I think was going too distant too soon.

When I do go on dates I just kind of focus on enjoying myself. 2 of my long running FWBs were same night lays.

 

[MILFandCookies]

@joe_ronimo
What's your lead up to sex look like?

You might be inadvertantly screening IN ONS types of girls. I think Andy's template does polarize for that.

It might also be your immediate follow up too. I had a string of girls that I slept with, but wasn't able to convert to regular FWBs. A big part of that I think was going too distant too soon.

When I do go on dates I just kind of focus on enjoying myself. 2 of my long running FWBs were same night lays.

My lead in to sex is the problem - and this is what Andy meant when I was screening in ONS type of girls.

I'd screen pre-date for sex ("Meet me here at Xpm and if we like each other, I've got chocolate wine at my place we can try. No pressure to end up in bed if we don't have a spark.") meet for a bite or a bubble tea (I don't like bars/drinking) chat for a bit (she'd always be down since I screened hard up front) and back to my place in 15 minutes max.

I know I was screening super hard for sex, and probably screening for one night stands accidentally.

I still want sex on the first date. How can I screen IN for sex, but also IN for fwb-type-relationships rather than one night stands?

 

[Thebastard]

Do you find these women are ghosting you after the ONSs? If so perhaps just keep screening as usual but change something during the meeting itself. I know its cliched and maybe you already do it but try to connect with a long chat after sex and try your best to make her come. I am only mentioning this because I rarely have trouble getting girls I hyperscreened to meet again. Probably because of these things.

 

[Aloofus]

@joe_ronimo
What's your lead up to sex look like?

You might be inadvertantly screening IN ONS types of girls. I think Andy's template does polarize for that.

It might also be your immediate follow up too. I had a string of girls that I slept with, but wasn't able to convert to regular FWBs. A big part of that I think was going too distant too soon.

When I do go on dates I just kind of focus on enjoying myself. 2 of my long running FWBs were same night lays.

My lead in to sex is the problem - and this is what Andy meant when I was screening in ONS type of girls.

I'd screen pre-date for sex ("Meet me here at Xpm and if we like each other, I've got chocolate wine at my place we can try. No pressure to end up in bed if we don't have a spark.") meet for a bite or a bubble tea (I don't like bars/drinking) chat for a bit (she'd always be down since I screened hard up front) and back to my place in 15 minutes max.

I know I was screening super hard for sex, and probably screening for one night stands accidentally.

I still want sex on the first date. How can I screen IN for sex, but also IN for fwb-type-relationships rather than one night stands?

Oh yeah man you are screening for sex, hard up front.

So I've had my current FWBs for over a year now at this point. When I met them I hadn't read any of Andy's stuff yet, but was doing something pretty similar.

I still had sex with them on the same night too. Generally I don't push for same night lays. Though I'm not going to ignore the signs she's ready if they're there.

With that said you can probably change how you're messaging girls to be less polarizing, but still escalate hard on the date. Though probably not 15 minutes and bounce. I'd say probably 45-60 minutes instead.

Some women are legitimately looking for someone for a serious mono LTR. You might end up in dates with them screening less, but probably not.