The Best Mentality for Dealing With Flakes and Ghosts

personally i'm not following this thread but

Manganiello said:
I'm used to inexperienced guys going on and on about theory that's either totally inaccurate or detracts from people actually putting in the work.

So I made the decision to lock this from that lens, when in reality there was actually a valid discussion from some of the more experienced guys with differing points of view. Which in itself is actually very valuable.
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i basically agree with this

i didn't get immediately triggered and comment "zomg this is just yet another redditposting theory thread bro go make a progress log mods pls lock" because pancakemouse is obviously in the category of "people putting in the work"

and the people actively discussing here are also in that same category of "people putting in the work".

so i think the occasional thread where established hustlers are trying to help each other figure out mindsets in dating seems conducive to "making the forum a better place". for that matter, people also make guides like this.

the thing that differentiates this thread from a lot of the threads that get locked are noobs with like 12 posts talking about random theoretical points in a vacuum without a consistent progress log or otherwise obvious experience (so we can even see where they're coming from) (example lol).

yes this is a 100% pure ethos argument

(although, tbh i still feel like u should have put this in ur progress log lol pancakemouse)
 
Thanks Manganiello

But I think, you can lock it...we have said pretty much all that is needed to say from all camps and we would grind to fine sand all points.
Both arguments have been presented, so inexperienced guys can read this one up and decide what is their best approach.

Again, as someone with 1000+ cold approach daygame sets, I've seen the best way to deal with this is a pancakemouse described, and it's the same for other guys that i know who have more work in dg done than me
 
Holden said:
"Just assume she doesn't like you and will replace you soon with a better man"

What a way to go through life.

The way to not care about flakes is to have lots of sex with attractive women.

If I have a threesome planned with two slim hot 20 year olds I'm not going to cry because a 26 y/o from Bumble cancelled a date or stopped replying.

I do agree with the old PUA advice, somewhat echoed here, that said "always fuck her like it's the last time you'll ever fuck her."

I also don't agree with the hypergamy idea.

When my MLTRs/high-end FBs break up, it's not because they've found a better guy than me. They always leave me for guys who are objectively worse looking than me (and judging by appearances, don't fuck nearly as good) but they promise them monogamy and at some point they'd rather nail down a less-desirable guy and be mono than keep sharing the 'alpha'.

In fact, when they leave, they leave because they're butthurt that I won't commit to them and other guys at my SMV won't commit either so by definition they have to settle for a lower SMV dude. Is that hypergamy?

When they end up back in my bed after 10 months when they break up with their boyfriend, is that hypergamy? Or when old plates text me "I like my boyfriend but he doesn't fuck like you do", is that hypergamy?

I was a bit down when Vocal Girl 'broke up' with me, it seemingly came out of nowhere (in hindsight it didn't - I pushed the threesome question too much despite her resistance and she finally realized I would never commit to a girl who wasn't open to threesomes with me, so she left) but I knew that she'd back sooner or later and 10 months later I was fucking her again and hearing all about how she missed me/my cock.

Nympho Girl 2 had to delete her Tinder because her phone would literally crash every time she opened the app. Now she always drives 2+ hours to my place (and has to lie to her parents about it) to come see me. She texts me obsessively to the point where I have to regularly ignore her which only turns her on more because none of the other guys on her IG ever ignore her. She texts me stuff like "I have to admit it hurts a bit when I see you post Stories with other girls." She has 10k Instagram followers but obsessively checks if I watched her Story.

Caught an old MLTR from years ago accidentally liking a Facebook post of mine that was 4 years old (she was stalking my profile.) Playfully called her out on it and tried to get her to come over and she told me "you know I want to, but what would I tell my bf lol?"

I'm just trying to make a point with real examples here that, god forbid, girls might actually like you.

I don't see the point of trying to get good with girls only to go through life with the mindset of "they don't actually like me."

This is a really weird post to me. Girls reject everyone and they're hypergamous so the rare time I get my dick wet, I consider it a bonus! Thank god that this girl fell through sheer luck through the alpha cracks! But best assume it won't last long!

Is this how winners think?
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This would be the perfect advise BUT 99% of men will never this level no matter the work they put in.

If the girl is above 7/10, I will never be the hottest guy she fucked. The fact that you can confidently say that you don’t care a girl leaves because she won’t find a guy with hoger SMV means you are ridiculously lucky with your genetic potential.

As for the average guy who is going bonkers hard to reach his potential, the advise given by pancake is the way to go. I agree with Zug that keeping a little bit of feeling is good, especially if you ever want to consider dating some longterm or marrying someone
 
kratjeuh said:
If the girl is above 7/10, I will never be the hottest guy she fucked. The fact that you can confidently say that you don’t care a girl leaves because she won’t find a guy with hoger SMV means you are ridiculously lucky with your genetic potential.
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I think he was saying she won't find a guy with higher SMV that is willing to commit to monogamy. I'm sure for casual sex she could absolutely find hotter guys.

That being said, I would be extremely surprised if Holden's face was not top 5-10%, given his results.

But I'll shut up now because this blackpill theory stuff just makes me want to jump off a bridge.
 
This is getting a bit too Blackpill.

Go put in the work.


And watch this...

https://youtu.be/cHmuxi3Jj2Y
 
Agreed with Manga - as ever, we can focus on action as a precipitant of success, but I would like to add an angle on what my action & work taught me about empowering ways in which we can access abundance through internal, as opposed to external, means.

Abundance can go beyond things like attraction and sex. Abundance can be a level of consciousness, a state of mind.

We evolve with our thinking, because there is part of us that does not want us to suffer, and is working on realising our greatest good for us.

When I used to look at attraction and sex from a perspective of gathering the lays and working towards 'abundance', which I understood as being able to get sex with new girls regularly, funnily enough, I often ended up in the dungeon.

Why is that?

I was focused on the external results.

In the real world, women are a multi variate, and are complicated, but certain truths are self evident: there’s different levels of attractiveness in this world, some of us may have external selves which are not everyone’s cup of tea, but of course may be beautiful inside, and hence may not be able to have the flow and sort of ‘conversion’ if you like that one may seek.

....AT THAT stage of their development.

Attractiveness is malleable, subject to change, and can be improved over a time horizon, and it stands to basic principles of logic and reason that with an increase in attractiveness, communications, masculinity, vibe, and game, every male can hope very justifiably and rightly for a better day.

It will just unfold IN TIME. And with time, there will be joy, happiness, love and passionate sex. It is inevitable.

So how do you best manage that whilst keeping a sense of positivity?

….It’s still a road, and when traversing a road that is, in and of itself, a multivariate, the stories we tell and the doubts we have are prone to flare, because if it was simple, you’d not think twice. You don’t doubt your ability to lift a pen, and you as such have no fears over your ability to do it.

Because I found getting the sort of sex life I’d like quite arduous, it inevitably would become tiresome and then eat away at me, and pull me down into lower states of mind, lack, scarcity, and then the lowest levels of consciousness indeed.

That happened again and again, but for myself, and I can only share my experience, I kept working on myself at every level, and began to see things differently as I healed and grew more in my mindset, and my own healing which I do via transparency.

There is a way to turn the ‘negative’ into positive, and help get out of the dungeon: abundance can be thought of in different ways.

Abundance can be an ecosystem of internal value, positive emotions, and self love, appreciation, and belief in the goodness of the human animal, in fighting for a better world, in believing that a reduction of the world’s suffering is possible through the shining of one’s internal light.

When a certain value in oneself is held, and internalised through self improvement, you find joy in little things, feelings of success bloom within you, and I think this does radiate into our relations with women and subsequent ability to get great experiences alongside them.

The true prize is sinking into our deep masculine core.

The true prize is our state of mind, the sense of entitlement, the sense that, yes – I am enough, I deserve good things, and if I do good for myself and others, SUCCESS IS INEVITABLE!!!!

That is where deep internal abundance can flourish.

When one loves themselves, and when one truly appreciates the goodness and beauty that is within themselves, YOU CANNOT BE DEFEATED. You will bounce back and win, every time.

This approach to abundance is one I came to after almost 1.5 years of absolutely full-on, deep, hardcore self improvement, 1000+ day game approaches in this time, 100+ dates, 9 lays, and endless, endless work on myself.

All approaches are valid, and what Pancake says is valid for him, Holden’s take valid for him – we are all individual men, but my truth to you all my brothers, is that anyone on the self improvement journey is a force for good in this world and will always get my love & respect.

MAC
 
pancakemouse I agree with this 100%. Even in my own journey, what I find is helping me most is just simply letting go of what I can't control.

I can't control when I'll get a text back.
I can't control if they ghost.
I can't things coming up in their lives that cause them to ignore me
I can't control another human being.

All I can control are my inputs, and my time is best spent focused on that. Doing the work to get better so I can to realize my potential to see what results I am capable of after doing enough work.

Even with the cold approach, sure it stings when things don't go my way the majority of the time, but it's certainly teaching me lessons that I think go far beyond the game of attraction.
 
Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference
 
september said:
Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference
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Pretty much everything that needs to be said.
 
There are 2 ways to avoid having to experience this:

A) Improve your looks / status or wealth to the point where you have so many options that it doesn't matter.
B) Go for girls that are the same or slightly lower SMV than you. They won't flake on you as much.

That's it.

The problem is that we're generally chasing girls higher up the SMV ladder, and thus the process is wrought with emotional turmoil.

If you do either of those things you won't experience anywhere near as much emotional pain.
 
That's quite solid advice. In fact, I've noticed this seems to be some sort of natural transition among guys who do primarily day game, leaning towards a more stoic, less validation-seeking and less invested behavior.

Because as you do many approaches, go to many dates and experiment with different interactions, you do realize, it is indeed, for the most part, the last time you're seeing her and ghosting will happen.

You also notice it can't be really something personal (again, for the most part). Some of these girls were interested, they thought you were hot. Some even told you for no reason at all. Yet, they ghost.

I personally see no direct link between whether she'll ghost and her appearance, I just feel like most girls, hot or not ghost, regardless.

I think that these sorts of experiences, "negative outcomes", if you will, and not the positive ones, are what really build up that tolerance. Perhaps that frustration one might experience whilst going through these experiences is just a mere step in the process of achieving this.
 
The women that matter will communicate with you often. The ones that don't are just missing out. It's just a part of life that is full of uncertainty. Can try to increase odds by improving yourself. Can think of it like trying to dig for gold, there's going to be a lot of scrap metal found in the process.
 
I haven’t hooked up with many super hotties yet, if I match up with one I do feel a bit angsty about her, a bit of desperation hoping I’ll get to meet her at least.

Once I meet though I can accept whatever outcome happens because I know I will naturally do my best taking into account my personal stresses and situation.

This is why I really wanna make cold approach part of my life, skips directly to in person interaction.

If I had a super hot fuckbuddy I would definitely care less if some match flakes or whatever.

It seems like many things in life, once the ball gets rolling things only get easier not harder.

I’ll say this though, the “state” you are in affects what your “philosophy” is and that can change day to day.

Sometimes you can feel “stoic”, other times some other shit.

Personally my favorite vibe is “smile enjoy life”, not taking things seriously and just having a good time enjoying the process of talking to girls whether online or in person, it seems in such a state I’m just happy full stop, I love girls and I love pussy and I’m gonna get after it and whatever happens happens, if I go home empty handed I’m still a happy camper :)

I think this is “the way” like in Taoism, Tao Te Ching, it’s just such a happy way of life, it’s such a pleasure to live this way.

The challenge is to get to that point, ironically though we’re all born this way and society molds us to suffer.

This ain’t even about getting laid in particular, just a way of living life such that you actually enjoy the experience of living your life. Lol
 
Like for example a few days ago I matched with a legit hottie on hinge she was in the “standouts” section, one of her photos is super fuckin hot.

I msged her and was really hoping she’d reply and she did , small talk later I ask for number and we’ll grab drink.
She replied she’s down but doesn’t drink but didn’t send number.
I msged back saying that’s cool we can get food and so what’s your number.

I felt desperate cause I’m a horny bastard and she’s so fuckin hot and I want her, so when she didn’t reply for a day or whatever I messaged again hoping it would “refresh” in her chat or whatever saying we can just go for a walk too or whatever.

Then weekend came no response still and in my desperation I messaged again “how about this weekend???”

No response,
Then 2 days later in final bout of desperation I messaged
“😮‍💨 got all excited for nothing I guess”
Which is the god honest truth, I was excited I meet her and now I felt it was for nothing, and my desperation felt a sense of closure and I let it go.

Then a day later she responds
“Sorry I barely use this app 😂😂”

Desperation reignited
But not as much
I said “lol what’s your number then”

And tonight she sent me her number

Then I text her hey sexy, she reply “?”
I txt “it’s boris, what’s up”
And now we’ll see…

But point is yea I feel a sense of “scarcity” rn with super hotties I really want this girl and I accept this is how I feel rn.

I just can’t do the “stoic” thing atm although in the end I do accept whatever will happen.

But it is what it is I’m fuckin horny for this girl I want her so bad I wanna eat her pussy and fuck her while making out and feel up her whole body and I’ll feel a bit sad if It doesn’t happen.

I think cold approaching will help with a sense of “abundance” as well as having a bette dating profile so I can get more frequent hot matches.

These are the “actionable” steps, everything else kinda at the mercy of where you are in life and the kind of person you are.

I mean brahhhh honestly I’d rather be desperate horny fucker that I am vs the virgin porn addict that I was for many years to whom any hottie anywhere was an out of sight and out of mind.

All part of the process
 
Lol now a day later I’m like why did I spend all that energy writing all that, just goes to show how our “state” affects us.
 
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