Brandon Builds - #38 Poly Girl

[Bman]

Busy week leading up to my birthday and taking full advantage of my last month here.

Last Saturday I went to the private residence kink party I attended last summer. One of my past lays, Lips Girl, invited me out as her plus one. Funny enough, I also knew 2 of my other lays were going, Event Girl and Buddhist Girl. Did some kink play there and just generally socialized. Didn't feel much like having sex with Lips Girl as I knew the next few days were filled with other girls I'd rather save my energy for.

Had Nurse Girl over on Monday. She's doing a lot better and it was really good to see her. Had sex with her right before my munch.

Then had Bumble Girl over on Tuesday. Another great night with her. I enjoy her juxtaposition of being modest and then kinky. She came over in a sweater that covered her curves, but then was in lingerie underneath and told me before we started having sex that she likes being spit in her mouth. I also simulated a bit of CNC play for her. After she had given me head, I picked her up and threw her up on the bed. I crawled on top of her and pinned her arms above her head. She still had underwear on, so I dry rubber my cock over her underwear while gripping her wrists. I could tell she was really enjoying and she tried resisting with her arms. I let her "win" for a second, letting off pressure, before pinning her completely down. She loved it. After sex we cuddled for a long time talking about deep topics. Next day she sends me such a modest text thanking me for the night, like we didn't just have kinky wild sex. I love it.

Yesterday I went to my last Shrine munch. I was expecting to just say goodbye and hang with regular friends, but instead there were a lot of new people. So I mingled. There was a young married couple that was sat next to me. The husband was directly next to me while our group conversed for a while. Then he went to go get another drink and his wife immediately closed the space between us, schooching up close to me. She was a skinny, dirty blonde Russian who grew up in London and moved to the US at 19. I was talking kinks with the group and occasionally would get interrupted by someone that knew me and wanted to say hello, shake my hand, so on. Eventually everyone in the group had started having side conversations, so I took my moment to start chatting up this Russian girl. Her and her husband are in an open relationship. She's an OF girl who does latex and femdom things, shoots with other girls, but is actually really subby and only does the other stuff for work. By this time, our legs are fully touching under the table, we've kept eye contact with each other and zoned everyone out, and I'm getting a little turned on. I ask her what kink has been top of mind for her to really want to try lately. Having heard me talk about rough/primal sex earlier, she mentions that she really wants to do more of that, saying she wants to be dominated more organically and not so planned out, more in the moment. Of course, she does. She wants the guy to just get it. I tell her I'm leaving in a couple weeks, but we should find a time for her to come over, which she enthusiastically agreed to and asked me if we should exchange numbers. So we did. I'll slot her in next week.

Luckily tonight I get some downtime.

Tomorrow I'm meeting NightRoller who is visiting Austin for the weekend.

Saturday I have a date with a skinny blonde dancer (who I would later learn is also a stripper) who I connected with on Feeld three weeks ago. She was overly excited about matching with me, which I playfully teased her a little about. As typical, I tried scheduling the date soon, but her parents were coming into town for two weeks and she would not be able to go on a date till after her schedule freed up. I pushed a little basically saying it might be nice to get a break from the parents and come out but that didn't work out. She said she would text me after the couple weeks. Figured it was dead in the water and moved on. Then she texted on Tuesday night asking if I was still up for meeting. So I shot over some times and it was easy as that. No chit chat, just logistics. I'm a little curious as to what made her so eager and interested enough to take her own initiative to reach back out.

Sunday is Shrine. Nightroller and a couple KYIL guys are joining me for the evening. I invited Bumble Girl out with me, but she is having her birthday party the night before, so she said she needs a recoup day even though she really wants to go with me. Have not heard for Politics Girl after trying to schedule her before her most recent work trip, but if she reaches out I'd enjoy taking her as well as it was a lot of fun the last time. Nurse Girl's daughters birthday is that day so she's not available. We'll see how Saturday goes with the blonde from Feeld, maybe invite her out. The Russian blonde from the munch will also be there, so I could potentially see a threesome of sorts with the blonde from Feeld. Or it could just be a social night, hanging with friends, we'll see.

Next Monday is my birthday, which I'm hosting my last munch on. So expect that to be a friendly, sociable night of "ohhh, we're going to miss you so much."

On the 24th, I have a threesome planned with Spiritual Girl and Nurse Girl. Looking forward to that.

On the 25th, I have a shoot planned with Ed and MilfandCookies. We're doing a "behind the scenes" style shoot where we take pictures of each other photographing a couple models. Luckily your boy is connected with models, so I just texted a couple in my phone and easily took care of that for us. Honestly felt pretty cool to be able to just text some girls like that.

And of course, filling in the the rest of the days by scheduling in all the girls for repeat experiences as much as I can before departing.

 

[Zug]

Having heard me talk about rough/primal sex earlier, she mentions that she really wants to do more of that, saying she wants to be dominated more organically and not so planned out, more in the moment.

This was my biggest ick with girls heavy into the kink scene. This over-reliance and crutching on ritualistic / autistic type of sex scenes with scripts and exact descriptions for every sequence of events that are to happen. NONE OF THAT is sexy, for anyone. I'm even willing to believe its mandatory for people doing heavy kink with a new partner, but as a general rule forever? No.

My personal experience is that the hottest types of BDSM are organic and involve constant slow escalation by the top where the top is paying close attention to the bottom and adjusting when the top notices any signs of hesitation or concern from the bottom. The bottom also needs to be willing and able to communicate when they want more or less intensity. Just because you're a bottom and not leading doesn't mean you don't have a role to play when it comes to displaying and communicating your enthusiasm and concerns. Its even better when they can do this through subcommunication. A girl shaking her ass at you to beg for harder spanks is hotter than her saying green, as is a girl rolling over onto her back then pulling you on top of her instead of her saying yellow and that needs a short break.

These 'soft' pinning of arms during foreplay are some of the hottest tools a guy can have in his belt. The other one I think is highly underrated is picking girls up. Picking her up and carrying her to your bed, picking her up during a make out, pulling her onto her toes, all of it. It directly communicates a power indifference and produces an immediate endorphin rush as they get lifted. Another variant that really works is really throwing her on the bed. The type where she is literally airborne for a second. Carrying a girl to the bed, then standing at the edge of it and throwing her slightly up and backward onto the bed where she is weightless for a second is a gigantic endorphin release for her. Follow that up with you crawling on top of her and pinning her arms above her head as you makeout with her and she is yours.

 

[Bman]

Lesson in Tantra

Before we get to the date report, let's have quick lesson in Tantra.

In Tantra there is the concept of "energy". I'm here to tell you right now that energy as a concept is bullshit.

Tantra as a spiritual tradition started by culminating scriptures and practices from many different tribes in Southeast Asia and would become the precursor to Hinduism and Buddhism. If you have ever heard Jordan Peterson discuss the Mesopotamian religions and Marduk, its very similar culmination of tribal beliefs.

Like most ancient traditions that did not have an understanding of biological processes in the body, Tantra's "energy" is not a literal thing but points to a real biological experience.

The practice of Qi-Gong is meant to restore and move "energy" throughout the body. In reality, the practices have you breathe deeply, which hyper-oxygenates the blood, and move the body around, encouraging blood flow of that oxygenated blood. This gets blood to places that naturally need restoration and brings more oxygen to the brain, making you feel more alertness and arousal.

What most people practice when they say they do Tantra is actually more accurately described as Neo-Tantra. Most don't even know where Tantra came from or that is has religious tradition, because most people are not fucking intellectual nerds like me and care. At the foundation of Neo-Tantra, when you strip out all the spiritual stuff, are biological components which produce real responses between you and your partner. These practices include using a combination of breath, eye contact, and touch which will work together to pull levers in your brain.

Now there is an experience which is often referred to as an energy orgasm. Again, energy is bullshit. But if we understand that an orgasm creates a neurological response and breath, eye contact, and touch can all create neurological responses, then in theory we may be able to simulate a similar experience.

None of you have probably done this so let me give you the closest experiences to it.

Think about the experience of cuddling, skin to skin and how you feel. That warm, fuzzy, floating feeling you get.

Now, think about the experience of holding eye contact with a girl for a really long time. That tension and antsy feeling get.

Now, there is a practice called holotropic breathwork, which is like deep breathing for 15-60 mins, and it's supposedly like doing DMT. I've never done DMT. I have done holotropic breathwork. But maybe some of you have at least done Wim Hof breathing (which is actually a form of tummo breathing). Think about that feeling of having super oxygenated blood flowing through your body, being hyper aware but calm and in tune with your body.

Now smash all those together and you're getting what I can only conceptualize as an energy orgasm. I don't really know. I don't have an MRI machine in my fucking bedroom.

Ok, so when I do Neo-tantra with a partner, I'm using all those elements as part of foreplay. Sometimes I do it in combination with another act, like deep eye contact while fingering her or edging her to orgasm and then stopping, making her breathe deeply several times and feel her entire body. Sometimes I do the entire ensemble together in the Yab Yum pose, touch, eye contact, and synced deep breathing, before getting to further foreplay. Why? Because it brings her deeply into her body, quiets her mind, and puts her in sync with me and my commands, all of which makes it significant easier for her to have multiple and blended orgasms.

When the girl is predominantly sexual or sensual, such as my Spiritual Girl, Bumble Girl, and Politics Girl, it puts them really in tune with their body and the sex feels fucking amazing.

When the girl is predominantly "energetic", like Tantra Girl or Psychadelic Girl (to some extent) in my logs, they really want the "energy" orgasm more than actual sexual touch and penetration. Some don't even want penetration at all. If the girl is hardcore into Tantra, I can almost guarantee this is what she wants. I don't do that. I also want to have intercourse and when I use Tantra it is sexual based.

Alright, with that preamble, lets talk about this date.

---

Date w/ Blonde Energetic Dancer - No Pull

Twas this girl.

Saturday I have a date with a skinny blonde dancer (who I would later learn is also a stripper) who I connected with on Feeld three weeks ago. She was overly excited about matching with me, which I playfully teased her a little about. As typical, I tried scheduling the date soon, but her parents were coming into town for two weeks and she would not be able to go on a date till after her schedule freed up. I pushed a little basically saying it might be nice to get a break from the parents and come out but that didn't work out. She said she would text me after the couple weeks. Figured it was dead in the water and moved on. Then she texted on Tuesday night asking if I was still up for meeting. So I shot over some times and it was easy as that. No chit chat, just logistics. I'm a little curious as to what made her so eager and interested enough to take her own initiative to reach back out.

Sent her a checkin text last night. She immediately texted me back saying she was looking forward to seeing me too. She said she was feeling quite curious about me. I still didn't understand why this girl was soooo intrigued already.

Before the date she even texted when she was leaving her house and on her way, which in my experiences, girls rarely do.

When she showed up we hugged and she gave a tight, long squeeze, like we had not seen each other in a really long time. After we released, we were still very close to each. We could have practically kissed each other right then and there. I then grabbed my drink and went to take her inside so she could get one. Inside we were still standing extremely close to each other in line.

Oh this is a done fucking deal. Feels like a 15 min pull is coming.

Went to sit down, she first goes to sit on the other side, and I tell her to come to mine, its not an interview. She ate that up.

We start chatting, legs already grazing each other periodically. Heavy eye contact. She moves the conversation slightly towards sex within about 5 minutes. So I pick it up, finding out some history, what she's done, and so on.

Then she casually drops she's been practicing celibacy for a couple years...

Screeeech! Wait...

Obviously I prod more to find out why I'm on this date right now.

She basically did it after getting divorced from a seven year marriage to find herself, create a secure attachment for herself, and not need another person. But she said she's opening up more now and exploring the tantra scene and BDSM scene, has a couple partners, and been going to play parties.

Ah, but your boy knows that there are a subset of people in these scenes that do kink only or just energetic play, and there is no sexual aspect. I also know that, especially some of the people who practice tantra have purely energetic partners. So all of what she just said could be misleading.

So I continue the conversation. It maneuvers around and it turns out we really click on a lot of other stuff, world views, experiences, and so, and I'm enjoying conversing with her. But I'm not here for chit chat. So lets get to the bottom of this. I asked her what she's looking for now and exploring. She says Tantra.

Fuck. She's an energetic girl, B.

We talk a little more. I can't remember what I said or asked, but basically confirmed with her if she was still being celibate or what the deal was, which she was and mentions that if she were to start sharing sexual space with someone she'd need to feel safe. Also, nothing in her profile eluded to the fact she was celibate. Energetic, but not celibate.

By the way, our body language has still been building sexual tension this entire time, but at this point I'm starting to pull back.

Well now I really want to know why she was so eager to meet me. So I ask. She said she's never got to experience someone dominant and into tantra. She also said I seemed really experienced and that with her other two partners she is the more experienced one and is having to lead the interactions but wants that masculine order from someone else. Which I show her I understand what she means by telling her she never actually gets to be fully feminine and sink into that submissive energy. She enthusiastically agrees. She also acknowledged that she really appreciated the questions I was asking during this entire conversation because it was leading her to so easily talk about it and express herself.

So now I'm not fully present in the conversation as much because I'm sitting in my head deciding if I want to pull, which I know I can absolutely do, and then spend a long time escalating back home. It probably would have been a steamy build up and building a safe container, but then dealing with the resistance of breaking her celibacy, and she was only going to want some energetic thing. That really did not sound like fun to me. If I were not leaving in a couple weeks and already have a packed schedule, I might have been more inclined because if we did not have sex today, I could have probably opened her up to it the future. No time for that. However, we are really vibing and the sexual tension is there.

I don't pull. I stay in the date, not fully engaged, but there. Eventually our conversation dies down and she asks me what I'm doing the rest of the day. So I just get direct. I tell her I was going to invite her back to mine, but I'm looking for a sexual connection and sounds like she's not. She affirms. I explain how I like to do tantra, which includes sexual touch. She tells me how grateful she is letting her know that. We talk a little more briefly about sex. Then I tell her I think really vibed and maybe in another time when she is more open (ahem... having sex) we'd have a great connection. She enthusiastically agrees. We give each other a big hug and part ways.

It was an enjoyable date. She's a dope girl. Just got cucked by my own archetype. Oh well.

 

[Bman]

Hello gents. Just dropping by to say if you want to read all this game material (or any ebook ever written) a lot faster, then checkout Speechify. I personally listen to all pods and audiobooks at 3x speed, so this is game changer for anything that only has written versions of it. You can also use it to read forum posts for those long ass posts that your eyes glaze over when you first see it. I know this sounds like an ad, but I think its dope and I'll promote anything that actually helps people learn. Just found it today. Keep kicking ass out there boys.

 

[Bman]

I'll have a much bigger update for how things went in my last month in ATX and getting ready to start traveling at the end of this week, but I wanted to record this experience because its one of the best I've had.

I've had Bumble Girl over a couple more times this month. Last night was her last time coming over. Honestly, there was no other girl I would have rather had to be my final time getting laid here. Never have I had such a connection with a girl.

It really felt like it was a culmination of everything I had learned over the last couple years here in ATX. I mentioned this before, but with her I never really feel like I'm performing or playing a role. It's the most naturally dominant I've felt before. We had some pretty elaborate sex, like using heavy boat chains to chain her to the bed and then I was just out of reach so she had to use only her mouth when blowing me and not her hands as she dragged the chains, and fucking her against the door as she was cuffed with her hands above. But it was actually the small things that I did so smoothly that really make the difference, like pulling her head back and spitting in her mouth when she was blowing me, whispering aggressive and possessive dirty talk in her ear from behind, transitioning from lightly choking her, covering her mouth with my hand, or smothering her head into the bed while fucking her. It was also one of the rare occasions that I changed between major positions without pulling my dick out at all. I just smoothly rolled and moved her wherever we needed her to be and I never stopped penetration. Everything just flowed.

After the first round, we just laid there with me still inside her and starred into each others eyes and smiling, each of us getting a slightly bigger grin. No words. Just bliss. We cuddled for a long time, talked about our pasts, and then spent more time just staring at each other with no words. Must have been an hour of this. We both off handedly shared and agreed it would be great to see each other again. I asked if she had any plans to traveling to the PNW this year. She said she is probably going to start being nomadic in the fall and said she might have to come out the PNW now. She also mentioned how unfortunate it was that we have been in Austin this whole time and did not know that each other existed.

At one point we were spooning and she was starting to get a little cold from the air conditioner, so just like in sex, I kept complete contact with her body, rolled her on top of me, and rolled her to the other side so the AC would hit me instead of her. I started getting hard again and we went for another glorious round. When we finished, we were sweaty messes and we just held each other for a while. I got up to drink some water and she literally licked the sweat off the front of me while I drank.

We cuddled for a little while longer and it was starting to get late. We would both start to get up and then end up kissing and embracing more, neither of us really wanting her to actually leave. She looked at me really sadly and said we have to break the spell sometime. So we kissed again and we got up. As we got dressed we kept interrupting the process by holding each other and kissing more. We finally got her out the door and I walked her out. The quiver in her voice as she said goodbye after our last kiss fucking killed me.

I'd been reading Game Solved and one of the concepts in that book is to push any interaction to as far as it will go, till you get a hard no or blown out. He states this in terms of approaches, but then extends the concept to any relationship you have with a girl, going on about all these adventures, trips, and stories he has with girls just because he kept pushing. This is where you'll learn the most.

So I sent Bumble Girl this text today.





I feel like I'm writing a real life romantic smut novel with this girl and I love it. If absolutely nothing comes of this, then I still get a great memory of an amazing girl. I'll be fine. There will be new cities, new girls, new adventures. But if I did not say this, there would have been a 0% chance of anything more. I also think something of this caliber is an excellent test if this relationship is worth creating anything deeper. I didn't do this with all my girls, but this is the second one to make a very loose note about being willing to come to the area I will be to see me.

Some part of me just wants to run this experiment of: how many girls can I get to fall in love with me in a deep way, bring value to their life, while seeing other girls, and being completely honest about those other girls the entire time? Can I have harems in multiple locations? Is it possible to have deep intimate connections with each of them and still live my life as an individual?

I don't really know the answer. I'm just enjoying finding out.

Next few days are taking care of some logistical stuff before driving off to Denver. Then it will just be a man, his dog, and the open road.

On to a new chapter.

 

[colgate / bulldog]

sorry this is completely irrelevant to your log but i laughed too hard at this unfortunate abbreviation of your post

 

[Bman]

Update

So I’m officially in Denver. Been here less than a week. I had some troubles with the van and had to get repairs in a city halfway between. Spent a few days there including Easter while I waited for a part to come in. The repair itself only took a day. But she’s running just fine now.

Already explored a couple areas and probably going to do some hiking this weekend. Scoped out a wine bar to start up a professional networking event and it looks like it will work out just fine. So I will probably get the event up at the end of this week and scheduled out for a couple weeks to give time for marketing. Of course a little anxiety a minimal amount of people will show, but that’s exactly how I felt about the munch. Just do it anyway.

Last month in Austin was great. It was actually a little heartbreaking to say goodbye to my girls, my friends, and the people in the scene. A lot of people said nice things about me which made me feel a little bit like I was attending my own funeral. I held up pretty well until it was the day before I was leaving and I was moving out my mattress to the dumpster. I recalled so many memories on that mattress and got flooded with emotion. That’s when the weight of my decisions really hit me. Doubt crept in, but everything was in motion, there was no turning back (not that I really wanted to).

Also, there was a poly guy who got laid pretty decently (at least from what I could tell) and in the scene who asked about taking up my munch. So I made standard operating procedures for him and basically handed him the playbook, short of telling him how to use it to get laid. I think he’ll figure that out though.

Girls

My threesome didn’t end up happening because Nurse Girl was on her period and just wasn't feeling great mentally, so she backed out. Still saw Spiritual Girl that evening though.

However, Nurse Girl had regret she did not get to see me one more time before I left, though we did see each other earlier in the month. She said some really lovely things and wanted to stay in touch.

Spiritual Girl also said lovely things and was willing to come out somewhere to meet again in the future.

Property Girl just fizzled out. Didn’t see her again. That’s ok.

Politics Girl and I tried to make plans, they didn’t work out. Then she just ghosted at the end. I was actually disappointed about the outcome of that. She was one of my favorite girls in the harem. Based on her personality though, I think she has an avoidant attachment style, and her behavior over the last few months I was there was her way of coping with me leaving. However I’d still really like to know if there was a behavior or action I did that led to this outcome.

Bumble Girl was great. Posts above. Hope to see her again if we can make plans for her to come out wherever I am.

Obviously I’m down to 0 now, but chatting with a couple girls from Feeld and one from Bumble. And will hopefully be getting some social stuff going for the short time I’m here.

Not really worried about getting laid right now, though. I’m actually enjoying the time and mental energy that has been freed up by all the sudden not having a harem, social circle, or setting up dates. God damn do we do a lot just to get laid.

Seeing the Ex-Wife

I met up with my ex-wife yesterday. If you have any chance of reviewing major life decisions and their outcomes, take them. If you were right in your decisions, it will give you confidence like no other.

When I made the decision to get divorced, and I told her I wanted to, I was making the prediction that our lives would be better if separated and the next stages of development of ourselves would be best done separately. I knew the outcomes on my side, which were positive, but I barely knew the outcomes of her side.

So I wanted to find that out. I also wanted to explore if there was still an attraction there, and if there was, see if she wanted to be a part of the harem in some capacity.

So I planned a date just as normal. If the vibe was there, I had full intention of escalating. Even had a condom in my pocket.

However, we started chatting and two things occurred:

1) she's gained just a little weight. Not a lot, but noticeable. Not surprised considering I did the cooking and meal planning in the relationship, I was the one that planned our workouts, and I led us to get low BF%. Honestly, after being with so many women, that's just a turn off for me now. Shallow, I suppose, but I know what turns me on and off. I didn't want to escalate, not be as into it, and then create a bad experience for both of us.

2) More importantly though, I realized that I may be able to have my cake and eat it too. Meaning I may be able to experience what it's like to have a deep friendship and shared experience with a woman, like you would after having a long marriage, and still be able to be a fuckboy.

She told me about the last couple years and that she's been looking for the structure, groundness, perspective, non-judgment, and so on that I used to provide and that she can't get that from any friends, family, or even therapy.
She told me about talking about me with her friends and family. She still always respected and honored me in conversations and would get annoyed if someone was speaking ill of me, much like you’d want your wife to do.

She’s making fantastic money and was told she could be COO of a company with her skillset (which I told her she could but of course she didn’t fully believe then). She’s looking to buy a townhouse or condo.

Overall I can see a great improvement in her self confidence and stand up for herself. She leaned on me a lot to do that when we were together. She’s also taking life with greater grace, treating herself well, and learning to solve problems.

She has been helping out a friend of ours with her kid and she said she can feel the maternal instinct kicking in. So still unsure if she wants kids.

She had not dated at all. As far as I know, I'm still the only guy she has slept with. Who knows. She told me the apps were kinda weird and was a little self conscious about presenting herself well on there.

I told her that I had dated, but obviously not how many girls I’ve been with. I just told her that “I did pretty well on the apps”. I told her about being non-monogamous and doing causal relationships. I told her about my adventures in the BDSM scene, going to sex parties, and building a community there. She’s also on my instagram so she’s been seeing my boudoir posts. She said she was not surprised, good for me and really happy that I had done so.

We reflected on just how much shared history, experiences, and understanding we have of one another - 10 years worth - and that we both missed having someone to be able to talk with that had that. I’ve had the most and deepest shared life with this woman. When we talk, we still want what’s best for each other. We still respect each other. We still want to help each other. We still care for each other.

But I didn’t want to fold her into the harem. That type of attraction was not there, at least not for me, not at this moment. So I guess I friendzoned my ex-wife. I told her I'd like to continue our deep friendship and be able to still be there for one another, still revealing ourselves to one another because we have so much shared history and understand one another. Practically, that will probably look like a call with deep talks periodically, sort of like I do with men's group, but I'll get to have a female's perspective who still deeply cares about me.

That seemed waaaaaaay more valuable than sex. With a little work, I can get sex anytime. I can't get 10 years of shared experience with a woman anywhere.

If I’m honest, this is what I wanted from my time in Denver, closing an open loop on a question if I had made the right decision. Did my actions as a man actually have positive outcomes for her, not just the divorce, but the whole marriage? And were those actions so valuable that they were hard to find afterwards and missed when they were gone?

In my books, the marriage AND divorce were a success. We’re both better people and still have a great relationship. I don’t know what label you’d put on it but the beauty is that it’s just between her and I and we’ll call it whatever the hell we want, exactly how we’d want it to be.

I might even help her setup profiles on the apps so she can find someone as good or better than me. I know I have set a high bar and would like to see her get someone at that level who shares her desires in life, since I don't necessarily.

I also told her yesterday that right now I'm wandering, but I'm not lost. I'm just experiencing life right now. I have so much less certainty about what "happiness" is or how life should be lived, meaning if someone asked me, I could not give definitive guidelines that you should live a certain way.

I feel like I'm searching for answers to questions that I'm not even sure of what is being asked. I guess the perennial ones - what does it all mean, what is love, what is a good life, what does it mean to be a good man, ect.

I feel very secure and not like I'm really striving for anything. Like, I'm not suffering, I'm fulfilled, I have what I want. I don't even know if I'm happy, but I'm content, joyful, and peaceful and those words are not synonyms of being happy.

Honestly, not even entirely sure what I want right now, I'm just moving forward with intentions: leave the world a better place than when you came into it, starting with the person right in front of you.

The success of my life will not be measured in how much money I make, monuments built, achievements attained or the liking. It will be measured by the people whose lives I made better having been in it. It's all I have ever really wanted, to leave people better off than I found them.

Advice on Marriage/ LTRs

So in the spirit of that, Zug recently asked me some thoughtful questions about marriage and LTR’s that I thought may be useful for those also desiring those in the future. So here is what I responded to.

“What questions and discussions do you think you should have had prior to getting into a serious relationship/marriage last time?”

- My ex and I were college sweethearts, so we were too young to really know what our values were, however that should have been a discussion beforehand.
- In depth discussion about money, who's expected to make it, who will manage it, what the long term goals of each person is and what financial resources are required to reach those, combine finances or keep seperate, how much to save vs spend on extras
- Similar to last but a little different, what quality of living is each of us expecting. Class differences from childhood will change values and expectations when older
- Roles - they don't have to be traditional roles, but you need to talk about how the household will be managed. The more nuanced you get, the easier a time you will have. We did this later in the marriage and it made us highly effective together.
- As the man, you probably have a vision for where you are headed. You need to make sure she is bought into that and you are taking into account where she wants to go.

“Do you think there were important topics of contention you could have brought up earlier that while they wouldn't have saved the relationship, would have led to better outcomes?”

- Money. Bring it up as early as possible.
- Sex. Figure out what your relationship dynamic is and be sure that both parties actually want that.
- Family. Not just kids, but how important being around family is, how much they are a part of your life, ect.
- Anything that bothers you about their behavior. However, don't accuse or call them out. It's better to do this with communication styles like nonviolent communication. But if you hold resentment, it will kill attraction faster than anything else.

“How would you approach doing a serious LTR again knowing what you've learned since?”

I'm a little unorthodox, and don't want to get married again, so this approach is probably not for most, but I would:

- Have a talk early laying out everything I think she would hate about me. If I'm really considering her as someone who I'm spending my life with, then she needs to know who I am at my worst and I need to know she will stick around for that. I'd also want to know her worst. It's easy to love someone's best.
- We'd both be non-monogamous - it's impossible for one person to satisfy all needs, and I'm not just talking about sexual needs. Also you need for her to see that you still have options even though you're committed to her. I just think actually having options is much easier.
- I'd keep finances separate unless we had the same socioeconomic background and spending/saving/investing habits as I did.
- She'd need to want to go in my direction in life. I tried the compromising route - it just built resentment for feeling like I was being held back. I'm too ambitious for that. Not saying this is a good/bad thing, I just know myself.
- Although I wouldn't get legally married, I may do some sort of symbolic union that was significant to us. However that would be several years in. I did not marry my ex wife until after 4 years of dating.
- You both need lives separate from each other. It's ok to have friends groups and activities together, but you also need ones equally separate from each other.

Some resources for you:
- Esther Perel - Mating in Captivity
- John Gottman's research on LTRs/Marriage
- All of Relationship Theory from Tom & Lisa Bileyu - great examples of communication, deciding roles, dealing with conflict, and building a business together
- John Wineland's From the Core
- Non-violent communication
- Imago Relationship Therapy
- Captain/ First Mate dynamic from the Red Pill
- 12 Levels of Dread from the Married Red Pill - this gets manipulative and toxic towards the end, but its still worth the knowledge
- The Female Brain by Louann Brizendine
- Tim Ferriss - How to improve your relationships
- Tim Ferriss - Relationship Check Ins / Meetings
- Jordan Peterson’s views on marriage are pretty good, particularly around behavior conversations, though he's a bit jaded by the fact that he did not have many partners and they got together in a small town

 

[Slickbackkhair]

“Do you think there were important topics of contention you could have brought up earlier that while they wouldn't have saved the relationship, would have led to better outcomes?”

- Money. Bring it up as early as possible.
- Sex. Figure out what your relationship dynamic is and be sure that both parties actually want that.
- Family. Not just kids, but how important being around family is, how much they are a part of your life, ect.
- Anything that bothers you about their behavior. However, don't accuse or call them out. It's better to do this with communication styles like nonviolent communication. But if you hold resentment, it will kill attraction faster than anything else.

Do you have some idea of how this would look in the moment?

 

[Bman]

“Do you think there were important topics of contention you could have brought up earlier that while they wouldn't have saved the relationship, would have led to better outcomes?”

- Money. Bring it up as early as possible.
- Sex. Figure out what your relationship dynamic is and be sure that both parties actually want that.
- Family. Not just kids, but how important being around family is, how much they are a part of your life, ect.
- Anything that bothers you about their behavior. However, don't accuse or call them out. It's better to do this with communication styles like nonviolent communication. But if you hold resentment, it will kill attraction faster than anything else.

Do you have some idea of how this would look in the moment?

Each one of those topics are its own conversation, and most likely multiple conversations.

I do not remember where I first learned the concept of a "Relationship Check-in" (maybe from Tom & Lisa Bilyeu) but I heard it many years later from Tim Ferriss and realized that's what we had been doing forever.

My Ex-wife and I had a scheduled evening, EVERY WEEK, where we would take a walk away from the house to discuss heavy topics and the status of our relationship. We got to the point where if something major happened during the week where we wanted to confront the other, we said to to each other we will address it during the check-in, which quickly diffused a situation.

My reasoning for leaving the house was to make the home a sanctuary. Of course you can still have heavy discussions there, but I tried not to tie negative emotions to the space. I never, never, never, had heavy discussions in the bedroom. Its the same principal I apply now with casual girls. The bedroom is fantasyland, not reality.

My reasoning for walking is that sitting down is more confrontational. When your walking side by side, its if you're talking to a friend. Walking also helps you think.

You can structure them however you like, but the intention is to celebrate what's going well in the relationship, address what is not, or to discuss topics that are required to be addressed in order to make the relationship highly functional.

It may sound pretty structured and logical, but there were many of times that one of us had heavy emotions during those walks. In fact, I initiated the divorce on our last walk and we both cried.

Not only does this make you highly effective as a couple, but it gives you practice every week of saying hard things to the other. Where I was not as good, and I advise all of you to be better, is expressing gratitude and appreciation more during those walks.

My ex and I were really developing into a power couple. You just need to have that power pointed in the same direction.

 

[Zug]

Do you have some idea of how this would look in the moment?

I explicitly brought up all the uncomfortable topics and expectations I could during discussion about moving in.

Who's doing what chores, how much is she going to pay to live here, whats her ideal sexual cadence per week, what level of fitness are we going to maintain, etc. How would a 'divorce' work if living together doesn't work. What are her options in that scenario.

It was definitely uncomfortable, but went through everything from kids, how many, religion, politics, crazy family members, alone time, together time, incidental time, visions of the future, her career aspirations, etc.

As uncomortable as it was, it was also equally obvious how dumb it would be to try to do this conversation AFTER. It would be impossible. One thing I also considered was, we need to make a list of habits that are stuff we would do when living together, but wouldn't do when married: e.g. joint accounts, major house changes, etc.

Its important to list and make note of those, because its incredibly incredibly difficult to dislodge bad habits after they're set. So making aware of what habits are temporary only and both verbally acknowledging that seemed important.

I took 2-3 weeks researching what matters in a serious LTR where you're living together/married and made lists and lists of questions. Once I had everything I could think of I had it open in a word doc and we went through it one by one for several hours while she was sitting on my lap.

 

[Bman]

Good shit, Zug.

There is no room for dancing around with this stuff. Just have the uncomfortable talks. Several hours of discomfort saves you years of suffering. You also set a frame early that this is stuff you will talk about and not shy away from.

Wish my naïve young ass knew this when I started. But I didn't. I learned. But you best believe that should I find a serious candidate for a primary partner, I'll be doing the same thing you did. Well done.

I'd recommend keeping that doc and revisiting periodically or when a major life event is about to occur. People change. Those answers will change as well.

 

[Zug]

I'd recommend keeping that doc and revisiting periodically or when a major life event is about to occur. People change. Those answers will change as well.

Haha, this was actually one of my questions. "What are we going to do and how are we going to handle when we change our mind about something important?"

 

[Bman]

Did a little kink night game yesterday. Zug gave me a heads up that one of the nightclubs here was having its quarterly kink night. Told me it gets hundreds of people, like Shrine did, and the hot ones come out for this. So figured, why not. Only downside for me is my regular bedtime is between 8-9, and the event started at 8 but didn't even pickup till 10ish. By that time I am tired, especially since I get up at 4:30am. I had the advantage with Shrine that it started at 6:30 and picked up by 8-9ish. This event is much more fetish night club focused and less play focused which brings a lot more kink tourists as we called in the scene in Austin. But the ratio of hotter girls was higher.

Rocked one of my red outfits with a nice red vest and no shirt underneath. Always makes my arms look bigger and body tapered. Funny, I got complimented 4 times on it. Met some guys from Wyoming who were here for a concert the next day. I had ran into them again later and they stopped me to show me they both had just bought red vests from one of the vendors there. Then ran into a different guy later in the night who was wearing a black outfit with a red blazer who stopped me and wanted me to try on his blazer to complete the outfit, said he would have given it to me had he not paid so much for it. Lol

Anyways, after getting over a little anxiety, I opened an alt girl who was actually one of the vendors there but didn't realize it. Ended up psyching myself out before we got anywhere substantial.

Later, I opened up a hot girl who was standing on her own while watching the performance happening on the middle stage. She was dressed a little more modestly but with some leather boots. Told her she didn't look she fit in with this crowd and just stumbled into the club. She told me she had come to the event last year, but has only really dabbled in stuff. Found out she was an airline attendant, she has a dream of opening up your typical Bali style yoga retreat center, and had just gotten out of a 2 year relationship and is focusing on herself and being free/ having some fun. We were talking around sex and finally got out of her she was celibate. Being that this is the second time this has happened to me, and looking back now, I should have pushed the celibacy thing, retorting that it was not very free of her, life is short, lets have an adventure, yada, yada. Next time.

I also counted about 3-4 girls who were eyeing me hard, that I'd pass a couple times as I wandered the club and continued to eye me hard when I'd see them again. They were average or above average. In the future, I would like to go to talk with these girls just for the practice. I think it will loosen me up more for when I go to open the hotter ones and I will probably do better.

I got real tired around 11ish and dipped so I could drive back to my parking spot and get at least 4+ hours of sleep.

It was fun though to do some in person stuff. Night game is not really my thing because I'm an old man and love my sleep way too much, but it did give me a hankering to do more approaching.

Fun side note that may be of interest to nipple-flip : I had been on Feeld a few times in the city I'm staying in which is right outside the Denver downtown area. In that neighborhood, the ratio is garbage - 10% - 20% attractive girls I'd swipe on. Way worse ratio than Austin. When I was in the artsy neighborhood where the club was, 60-70% attractive girls I'd swipe on. Way better. Unlike Hinge, you can't drop yourself in any part of the city. Feeld has a few select cities you can passport to the center of, Austin being one of them, but not Denver. So my hypothesis is that the cities Feeld allows you to passport to the center of are hubs with lots of alternative people. Luckily Seattle is on that list and I'll be there later this year. For my time in Denver, looks like I just need to explore the neighborhoods more. Probably will try to find out when that artsy neighboorhood is high in foot traffic and spend some time doing daygame there.

 

[nipple-flip]

regarding your fun side note: i fucking love finding out how things work under the hood. please keep us all posted as you go off on these adventures

 

[Bman]

Been almost a month since I posted. I'll save a the majority of what I've been up to for the end of this month when I recap my time in Denver.

Short version: been having mini adventures, hung out with the ex wife a few times, have had a lot of time to think about where I'm headed and don't feel like I'm wandering anymore, started up the professional networking event, met up with guys from the forums, and have started day gaming consistently to about every other day.

Which brings me to my question: Does someone have a good video, or could record one for me, of a proper and masculine stop of a girl who is walking? I'm looking for the version of when you two are walking head on to each other and when you are walking behind her. pancakemouse september

Day game has been going decent. I have a date tomorrow with a 20yo CU Boulder student. Was supposed to have it Sunday but we had to reschedule which is was really apologetic about. Was a really solid set with her saying she was so nervous because of how cute I was, complimenting my eyes, set the date before I left her in the store, and then hugged her when I left. Most defiantly the sweet, "good girl". Got another number today of young, slightly alt waitress. Set was ok. We'll see if it sticks.

Even DG with some guys from the forums including jakeD and then Zekler and his friend J. Even got the chance to DG a few 2 sets with Zekler and J which was actually kind of fun. They are both socially adept enough that we could play off each other and keep trying to move the set forward. It was both their first times out DG because they have done majority nightgame and online. Interesting enough though, going out with wings here was the first time I'd ever gotten blown out. When alone, reactions are always neutral or positive. And when I DG in Austin with Ed, I always had neutral or positive reactions there. So not sure what to make of that.

I decided to start day gaming again because deep down I knew that I would not be done with any of this unless I faced whatever fears still lie dormant. Honestly, its not even about getting laid, though that would be really nice, it's about collecting those last bit of confidence points. I also stopped using all the apps besides Feeld. Also shoutout to Squilliam. You've been doing great lately. It was inspiring.

I can tell my areas of improvement at this moment are:

1. Properly stopping walking girls: I'm fine with the girls who are meandering or chilling somewhere. But when it's the full pace or quicker, I usually get some anxiety about it only because I don't know the calibrated way to stop her. Which means I lose momentum and end up skipping some girls, which you can't really afford to do when volume is low some days.
2. Kicking out the conversation: My convos are pretty basic with minimal sexualization. I'm using the masculinity of a direct approach plus my vibe and body language to carry me. Which I can see gets me positive reactions, but then my convo can still be just friendly which falls short sometimes. This will get better as I get more used to this. I can already tell with some girls I can get calm, my brain comes online, and I can flirt more like with the 20yo CU student. But I need to get consistent at it.
3. Pushing the interaction as far as it will go: Today is a good example. Could have instadated that girl. But it's like I got myself into the set, got the number, chatted a bit more to set a date, and then I want out so I can breathe. Again, I need to find that calm center while IN set so I can asses and push the interaction further.

Anywho, hope you gents are killing it out there. I'll be back with the bigger update at the end of the month.

 

[pancakemouse]

Which brings me to my question: Does someone have a good video, or could record one for me, of a proper and masculine stop of a girl who is walking? I'm looking for the version of when you two are walking head on to each other and when you are walking behind her. @pancakemouse @september

DMed you.

 

[Olafsmash]

Which brings me to my question: Does someone have a good video, or could record one for me, of a proper and masculine stop of a girl who is walking? I'm looking for the version of when you two are walking head on to each other and when you are walking behind her. @pancakemouse @september

DMed you.

Can you dm me too

 

[Trickery]

I decided to start day gaming again because deep down I knew that I would not be done with any of this unless I faced whatever fears still lie dormant. Honestly, its not even about getting laid, though that would be really nice, it's about collecting those last bit of confidence points. I also stopped using all the apps besides Feeld. Also shoutout to @Squilliam. You've been doing great lately. It was inspiring.

Your journey has been interesting to read, and points like are interesting to think about.

DMed you.

Could I also be DM. It would be nice to see some videos, especially because I'm going to dedicate some time to Daygame while I sort out my dating profiles.

 

[Squilliam]

Honestly, its not even about getting laid, though that would be really nice, it's about collecting those last bit of confidence points. I also stopped using all the apps besides Feeld.

I agree with this sentiment. While getting laid is (obviously) part of my motivation for approaching, the bigger and more immediate benefit to me is the way it transforms your social skills and confidence. Personally speaking, my wings and mentors have said that my vibe and energy has changed a LOT since just a few months of approaching.

I personally felt that relying on dating apps left me feeling very shameful and with a lack of self-respect. When you approach a girl in person and get her number, you just feel like way more of a man. It's also way more thrilling and exciting. Apps really are chick frame, you're waiting for them to come to you.

 

[Bman]

Your journey has been interesting to read

Hopefully it has served some value in helping to change your own life.

It would be nice to see some videos

I'm not sure how much you've DG before, but I recommend just going out for a little while and attempting before watching too much content. It can unnecessarily fill your head and distract you.

---

I agree with this sentiment. While getting laid is (obviously) part of my motivation for approaching, the bigger and more immediate benefit to me is the way it transforms your social skills and confidence. Personally speaking, my wings and mentors have said that my vibe and energy has changed a LOT since just a few months of approaching.

Can't speak to your in person vibe, but I can see its doing you well. I'd be interested in hearing your date audio.

I'm not going to delve into the whole what form of game is better debate. I agree with Holden's sentiment about where else are you going to get a ton of girls who are single, looking, and can be highly screened for what you want? The apps have their place.

However, for me, I knew it was time to address this because:

1. I was still afraid to approach some girls. I'd see them, not approach, and the regret would tear me to pieces. I'm not ok with that. That's not living in integrity, being honest about my desires, or being courageous. I'm not being the man I could be. Whether accepted or rejected is of lesser importance. It's about owning myself, expressing my intentions, and being in integrity. Actually becoming seductive and scoring the girl is just the cherry on top.
2. I was not learning anything continuing to rely on the apps. I've had a plenty of lays from online. If I got another dozen from online I would not have learned anything new or improved in any significant way. My date game is pretty solid. I've learned how to market myself well. I've developed an archetype I enjoy. Now it just feels like all the girls online are Fallout NPC's and I have to use level 87 charisma to unlock the special dialogue and skip all the bullshit for the special ending. From the feedback given by the market and other guys, my vibe is pretty good. I know I have really good body language. I can connect really well with others in person. But you can't show any of that online. So if I can get over the fear, discomfort, anxiety, I think I could do well in person.
3. It just feels good. I love seeing them light up. I love hearing how soft their voice is. I love exchanging eye contact with them. I love when I hold their hand and they delicately place it in yours in such a feminine way. Feminine energy really nourishes my soul. I also love getting compliments in person. Narcissistic and validation seeking I suppose, but I love hearing how people love my beard, or what I'm wearing, or how calm and soothing my energy is. I was DG the other day and this girl with her friend just blurted out "you're really handsome btw". Felt fucking great. You don't get those same warm fuzzies from online. Maybe in the beginning, but that's long gone now.

I thought I was not going to be able to effectively be doing DG and social circle at the same time. I'm still doing and perfecting my social game. But I'm learning that depending on the context of the social circle, it will have varying lengths of time between getting together like weekly or monthly. So there is a whole lot of time in between available to be practicing DG.

I'm not totally ousting online. But I had to turn it off most of the apps in order to have the motivation to go out hunting. Same advice I gave to ManlyCockfellow a long time ago. I still keep Feeld running because its so prescreened for kinky girls and I'm not going to find that out anywhere. I still use FetLife because I'm building social capital on there.