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Brandon Builds - Rough Days with Girls

MILFandCookies, yeah I think you're right on the intimacy issues. I learned about some of OF Girl 1's fucked up past, with daddy issues and a neglectful mother. I'd bet Vegas Girl has some lack of love as a kid. Really sad, honestly. As I encounter more of them, we'll see if I decide whether or not they are worth the trouble.

---

In a short update, last night at Shrine was packed because of the holiday weekend. I did talk and hug with a bunch of girls, though they ended up coming up to me one by one, mostly when I was working, rather than in clusters to gain some pre-selection points.

Ran into Psychedelic Girl, who I dropped earlier this year, who was now become a switch and was in full leather Domme gear with her date on a collar and leash, given the name Pet for the evening and could only speak when told to do so. Of course she still wanted to stop to talk with me, asking questions about my life, while her date stood there... sheesh, poor guy.

Was doing a first meet with another girl from fet who I'll be setting up a date with. Just did a brief hello with her before going out the door. Older woman, but petite, still good looking, and submissive. Apparently she knew Psychedelic girl and had run into her before she found me, telling me Psychedelic Girl says hello.

Briefly spotted Vegas Girl at the end of my night. She was wearing pretty much the same getup that she came to the date with me on. Like c'mon girl, this is a fetish club. Put a little effort in. Anyways, I didn't engage.

OF Girl showed up pretty late. I had already spoken with and hugged her best friend earlier in the night. I didn't go engage with her either because it was time for me to go home for sleep. Had I went and engaged with her, I know I would have stayed longer and regretted it later.
 
#28 - Trio Girl

I mentioned in my last lay report I was going to stop doing the long form reports just because I’ve learned what I needed to from them and the glitz and glamour of a new lay has worn off.

However, I’d still like to record versions here minus all the full breakdown and juicy details for posterity’s sake and record any lessons I’m still learning that may be helpful to others.

Trio Girl is 39 however she’s petite, still very attractive for her age, and an excellent kisser. She was actually better looking in person than her photos. I’ll say, my sweet spot has been 25-30 year olds, but the few older women I’ve been with that are sexually open, have been a pure pleasure. They are less hassle, more mature, and pretty good in bed from the extra years of experience. As long as they are still keeping themselves tight, I’m all for them.

This girl liked a couple of my photos on Fet, so I immediately friend requested her. Opened her with “Hello miss. Something catch your eye?” She was very straightforward and compliant the entire time setting up the date.

Date was pretty standard. Learned she’s in long term trio with a girlfriend who lives here and a boyfriend who lives in France. The bar was doing open mic night for comedy, which I mentioned to her they were doing it pretty early. She said it was early and we checked the time. We’d only been there for 30 minutes and she said “Wow! We really got into it fast,” remarking at how quickly our conversation went deep and turned to sex. If things are going well, 30 mins is pretty normal for me.

When I went for the pull she gave some token resistance saying “Yes and no…” I just sat back and asked her what the no part was about. She kind of anxiously smirked and thought about it. I don’t think she really had a reason. But she said “I’d like to kiss you first. It’s kinda my last check to see if there’s chemistry. Or you kiss me…” I motioned my hand to come closer and sternly told her to come here. As she leaned in, I wrapped one hand around the side of her throat and kissed her several times. I pulled back and she did an eyes closed “Mmmmm”. She opened her eyes and I just locked eye contact with her, staying silent. After about 10 seconds, she said “Mmm. Okay. Yes!” I rewarded her with a few more kisses and we left. Back home she was 100% compliant, submissive, and no resistance at all.

Sex with her was great. She’s very good at the nuance of everything: varied kissing pressure, lots of spit and great technique giving head, understands how to grind in cowgirl, and knows how to move her body when being manhandled. We seriously did kiss a lot and kept mentioning to each other how great of kissers each other were. Being she was older and experienced, I gave myself some unnecessary pressure in my head and did go soft a couple times. Really was not a big deal at all and we both still had a great time.

We connected a lot over being previously married, now divorced, and practicing non monogamy. It’s great to have conversations with women that have had more life experience. She also told me her motto was “Say what you mean, do what you say” which obviously resonated hard with me.

Would love to keep her around. She described how she likes having play partners, basically setting up a consistent day in the week and having it scheduled. No need for much texting in between. And my life is my life, she doesn’t really need to know about it or my other partners. She is totally down to do dates though, so still very much open to connection. Just likes having a set container for it. Also introverted so she enjoys her space, as do I. So if she stays around, it will be great, no hassle kinky sex.

---

Another date this evening with a different 40 year old sub from fet. This one I met at Shrine last weekend, so I’ve already seen her and know she’s still attractive. Again, this women has had more depth to her which is such a lovely change of pace, especially after Vegas Girl.
 
Had the date with 40 yo sub. Felt platonic, but with an undercurrent of attraction from both our sides. She was a little hard to read and seems to be trying to be more reformed from her early wild hippy days, but also diving head first into the BDSM scene. She also raised in a cult as kid. Anyways, pitched the pull but she mentioned even before the date she likes to meet people and think about them later. Of course I could have overturned that, but the date was pretty friendly, rather than sexual. I'm curious about her, so willing to do another date.

I also need to schedule a second date with the boudoir model. It's been so long since she was going on a trip right after our first date. So its a long shot, but she's too damn hot not to try.

So that brings me to my questions. Historically, most girls I pull the first date and if it's a no, then its a hard no. A handful of girls I've had go to second dates, but most fell through I think because of trying to get them to come straight to mine with clear intentions of sex, or trying to schedule them to quickly, coming off needy. I've only converted one second date, and it was a straight to my place.

So, what's the rules of thumb for second date logistics?
  • Seed the second date during the first date?
  • Schedule the second date during the first date? Or schedule over text later? If so, how many days later to reach out to schedule?
  • How far out to schedule the second date?
  • Straight to your place for an activity? Or go out to a different place and pull back?
  • Any other words of wisdom for things I'm ignorant to seeing is important for a second date?

Just looking for some guidelines here till I learn it for myself and can follow my own model.
 
Bman said:
Seed the second date during the first date?
Schedule the second date during the first date? Or schedule over text later? If so, how many days later to reach out to schedule?
How far out to schedule the second date?
Straight to your place for an activity? Or go out to a different place and pull back?
Any other words of wisdom for things I'm ignorant to seeing is important for a second date?
Click to expand...

I'm not personally good at this - my summary of what more advanced guys told me

- seed the second date as early as possible - not really as a second date, more as just "we should do x activity [at my place]" sometime. and you should be seeding as much of this stuff as possible always - it both helps with the logistics of actually scheduling things later and is a strong comfort/future building toool
- schedule over text later. you want her to not be sure if you're going to see her again after the date ends, unless it's super super on. the frame is usually that you have to think about the date after it's over to see if she's a good fit. wait 0.5-1 days.
- schedule it to happen as soon as possible
- straight to your place

this is the blackdragon 2 date model pretty much
 
I don't use a 2 date model, but its happened just a few times. All of mine that worked out involved at least moderate physical intimacy (them sitting with legs across me or the like). I don't think you need to do heavy pre-seeding. Just general idea that you're interested in seeing them, or at least its a real possibility. If there's too much ambiguity, the girl gets self conscious, feels bad, then blames it on you, then rejects you to 'take her power back'. You just need a little ambiguity, large amounts are harmful.

The second date NEEDS to happen fast, not a week out, like 2-4 days is deal imo. The positive vibes from one good date with no sex fade really fucking fast. Especially if they're younger and hot, you need to make the second date happen very quickly unless she has an unreal amount of buy in.

I tried straight to house dates for 2nd date, even after fucking once its risky imo. The girls appreciate some plausible deniability and especially if sex didn't happen on first date they're likely to care about such things more than the general dating pool. I would schedule some quick activity date, then pull back to yours.
 
Ideally it's seeded but not really necessary, you can always through text make up a story about how you were gifted a bottle of wine and you need someone to drink it with or whatever

Speed is the name of the game tho as others have pointed out, the sooner the better

I always do straight to my place. As a girl you can have some genuine concerns to meet a guy at his place for date 1, but all those concerns should be gone by date 2. Anything that remains is just bullshit (like her own made-up rules as opposed to real safety/catfish concerns)
 
Solid, thank you september, Zug, Holden. Seems my intuition about speed was correct. I'll give these a go.
 
Update

Girls

Politics Girl: Just had her over yesterday. As given by the name, she’s getting busy with politics season right around the corner, but getting her over once a week or so.

Spiritual Girl: Returns this weekend. She texted me how much she missed me (and fucking me) and I’ll see her Sunday. She’s super easy to schedule in once a week so glad to have her back.

Trio Girl: Tried to get her back over for the lock-in this week but she had some unexpected travel to do. She’s pretty straightforward when it comes to logistics, so there is still some hope to get her over next week. During our first encounter she told me she likes scheduling a consistent day, her preference being Wednesdays, to come over. So hopefully that pulls through because it would be great to have another no hassle girl in rotation.

40yo Sub: Went for the 2nd date. Was a bust. Got the “not feeling it.” Not surprised and no loss.

Boudoir Model: This one I found interesting. We had our first date a month ago, great chemistry, made out at the end, but logistics we crap for the pull. Tried to get her over before her trip but no go. She went on a multiple week trip to Europe and figured it was going to be dead in the water trying to get her out after, but still worth a shot. Sent her a text Sunday and got nothing. Took the loss, deleted the number, and moved on. She then texted me on Wednesday. She’s super busy but still keen on a second date, so we had to schedule out for the 30th! Normally I’d figure there would be no chance that far out, but responding after a month from the first date is abnormal, so maybe. I just find it funny because she already has a boyfriend, who’s a good looking guy, and hot which means she has plenty of options. So the chemistry and kiss must have been damn good to put in effort this far out.

21yo Stripper from Tinder: Was supposed to have a date this evening. Texted a confirmation text last night and got no response. Figured she was flaking and thought great, I can get some other stuff done tonight. Got a text earlier she is “feeling under the weather and won’t be able to make it tonight”. Told her thanks for letting me know. That’s all I wish girls did. I don’t care if you’re cancelling. Totally cool. Just have the decency to say so. Don’t ghost.

38yo from Feel’d: Date set tomorrow. She was funny because I did my typical flow, asking her what she was looking for, told her what I was looking for, and then she just threw her number over without me prompting for it. Anyways, seems promising on another, no hassle, once a week girl. Again, she’s older but still keeping things tight, and the maturity is always welcome.

Apps

Pretty much exclusively using Feel’d and FetLife now. After I got my new phone I would have had to setup Hinge again with a whole new profile. Not a big deal, but it is a time investment to be sending out likes every day and I already have enough leads coming from the other two apps. So I quit using it for now. I pretty much let tinder sit there and briefly get on, do a couple swipes, and check those who have liked me.

The leads I get from Feel’d & FetLife (and previously Hinge) seem more intentional and easier to schedule out several days. Matches from Tinder need scheduled within the next day or two, which is often not feasible with events or girls I already have scheduled.

Social Circle

The kink group is cruising along nicely. I’ve switched out one of the other leaders to someone more reliable and keeping an eye on a couple other potentials that I can hand the group to when I leave.

I learned through OF Girl that one of the groups here, which also limits their group to 18-35yo, apparently banned me from their group. I laughed because I never went to their group and everyone who previously went to theirs and now comes to mine says it’s not very good. I have no idea why they would ban me, other than they simply don’t like me. No bother. In fact, if they asked me how my group became so popular, I’d tell them because there is one component they would never be able to copy: me.

Van Work

Cruising along nicely. Just finished the metal framing for cabinets and starting all the finish material work. You’ll see my 365 is pretty much dominated by this when I’m not doing social stuff or seeing girls and for good reason. It’s one the number one things I can be doing for myself to change my lifestyle and pursue further goals.
 
Bman said:
I have no idea why they would ban me,
Click to expand...

You can only laugh in a world where “inclusivity and everybody is welcome” there are more petty power games and big ego issues.

I honestly despise these petty behaviors.
 
AskTheDom said:
Bman said:
I have no idea why they would ban me,
Click to expand...

You can only laugh in a world where “inclusivity and everybody is welcome” there are more petty power games and big ego issues.

I honestly despise these petty behaviors.
Click to expand...

Yup. People will be people at the end of the day, regardless of how "inclusive" things get.
 
Lmao they are definitely jealous. You seem like an awesome human being, I almost fail to see how anybody could hate you. But then again, nobody can be liked by everybody, haters gonna hate.

There's a saying like: "Everybody is the bad guy in someone else's story". So true.
 
Squilliam said:
You seem like an awesome human being, I almost fail to see how anybody could hate you.
Click to expand...

Despite the pettiness of it, I would still be keen to know what their reasoning is or which of my actions or behaviors triggered it. I have faults and I could be conducting myself in a way that I don't see. Knowing such, when I build and lead other groups in the future, I may be able to make an ally rather than an enemy. But I also wouldn't really be much of a leader in the community if I didn't rustle somebody's feathers.
 
Sounds like you're killing it man! Good work.

Funny bit on the group that banned you - and mature reaction, especially your response re: it would be useful to know if it was something you did, so you can be aware of it (even if you don't end up changing anything.)

Looks like you're progressing in all areas. Keep it up
 
I'm gonna pile on and say I'm curious what there reason was :lol:
cool to read the successes
 
#29 - Sorority Girl

Been a minute since an update, but I’m starting to draft out my end of the year review. My men’s group is flying in at the end of October for our end of the year retreat where we go over our goals from this year and set new ones for next year. So now’s a good time to reflect. Post coming in a few weeks.

In the meantime, here’s a new girl.

-----

Sorority Girl is a 23yo blonde sorority-type, bisexual, party girl who taking her masters in psychology and got into BDSM at 19 with her first boyfriend. Very cute, innocent looking face, not so innocent in reality.

Actually matched with this girl on tinder last year in Sept (phone pulled up convo when I went to text her this time). We didn’t make it out the first time due to who knows whatever reason in her life. Pitch a date, she was busy. Pitched another, lead went cold. I moved on. Until the rematch a year later. I had recognized her so opened with this.





This girl showed up to the date dressed to impress. She wore a short skirt with black tights underneath, tight black shirt with no bra with great tits and very low cut back, with hair, makeup, and earrings all on point. God I wish every girl put in this much effort. It truly is appreciated and I let her know that.

I’d somewhat put her on a pedestal in my mind only because she was a hot blonde sorority-type girl and first that I’ve gotten to take out on a date. Call it western brainwashing or what have you, but blondes and redheads definitely top of the list for me. I attract a lot of redheads it’s actually kind of ridiculous given their genetic rarity and makes me think it’s some biological gene match with mine or something. But blondes, they give me a run for my money.

Anyways, she gave me some nerves, but I was able to manage them for the date. In fact, I keep managing to surprise myself with how with time and experience, I’m getting more and more comfortable with women by instinct. When I took her in for a drink, I was standing inches from her, brushing up against her as we conversed in line. The coffee bar was packed last night, so I chose some high top chairs they newly added to a ledge which put us right next to each other, legs instantly touching. New sitting spot for all future dates for sure.
She was actually a great conversationalist, smart, very pleasant, and humorous. I teased her quite a bit about looking innocent, being repressed for not having traveled out of the US, not wanting kids, trying out being vegan, and so on. Actually writing this, I didn’t realize how much I teased and made her qualify herself.

Late in the convo I teased and transitioned the conversation to sex saying “So never been out of the U.S., was a vegan, you don’t sound like much trouble.”

She got a cute, bratty tone, “I’m not much trouble?”

“What’s the most trouble you have got into?”

“Wow. That’s a really good question. No one’s asked me that before.”

Which ensued to talking about kink and sex. Found out she had sex with another camp counselor in the camps chapel. So innocent.
She had gotten a small whisky drink. I’m not sure how long we were there for, but it couldn’t have been too long. Around 30 minutes. Went for the pull. Huge smile, no resistance.

Back home this girl was very sweet and very submissive, with just a tiny bit of brattiness, just enough that it’s fun and not annoying. I definitely wanted to fuck this girl, however I still had her a bit on a pedestal, so was pressuring myself to perform and show her a good time. Never works out. So cycled through being semi hard and soft and never made it to penetration. Told her I was in my head. She asked why. Told her it was just nerves, she was a beautiful girl and I just wanted to show her a good time, which puts pressure to perform.

“You’ve probably had plenty of girls in this bed and that were more beautiful than me.”

Damn. That hit. One because it was coming from her mouth. Two because after she said it I immediately said in my head that she was right. I didn’t say that out loud because it would not have made her feel good. She was hot, but not the hottest I’ve had there. And I just had Spiritual Girl lying right there the night before and would have Politics Girl lying there the night after. And a girl on tentative schedule for Friday. With all the effort, compliance, and me making her qualify, I’d easily flipped the script and probably was on a pedestal in her mind. Silly humans and their perceptions.

Still working at. Still learning. Slowly instincts our taking over. Slowly the mindset is shifting. Confidence is coming with experience. As the quality of girl continues to improve, more interactions means more desensitization. It’s still a process and a journey. Grateful to be on in it.

I didn’t treat it like a big deal. It wasn’t. Just always sucks right there in the moment. I just focused on playing with her, gave her a few orgasms, left some bite marks on her body, and gave some good spankings which she just ate up.

Politics Girl’s work is crazy right now, so she had to reschedule this morning for Sunday. So it leaves my night open tonight. I’ll invite Sorority Girl back over as she seemed keen to do so. If she doesn’t, it’s absolutely cool. There is always more.
 
Bman said:
So cycled through being semi hard and soft and never made it to penetration.
Click to expand...


Happens to me fairly often. Just a pattern with anyone for the first time. Never happens the second time. I think I need more comfort to “let loose”. Even with my ex, when I had gone overseas for a month or so and came back, I needed to reconnect emotionally before I was able to get properly hard.

Or maybe it’s not comfort. Maybe because I’m strategising and making sure that the date ends in my place, I am not focused on sex, I’m focused on the pull. And having just pulled, I am being careful to escalate and make sure there’s consent and everything, so I’m not yet relaxed enough to be in a sexual mindset and just let go and enjoy myself. That’s maybe why on the second date I have no trouble — I innately recognise I’ve got consent and I don’t feel any worry, I can just feel free to be sexual with her.

Regardless, what has always helped in the past for me was to do some foreplay, then chill out and just talk to her like a normal human being. And then the tension builds up after half an hour or so and then I can fuck Not sure what it’s like for you.

Anyway. Reading your log is exciting. I so rarely have girls who dress well for the date and I’m kinda sick of being the best dressed. I’ve only twice had girls ask me what to wear.
 
foducossy42, yeah its just a bunch of mental chatter really. I usually give my girls a lot of foreplay anyways and will alternate chilling and playing with them. In those moments what ends up happening is I will acutely be aware of me starting to get turned on, getting hard, and then double down on the pressure.

The "new girl nerves" is definitely a pattern for me. It's given me thought to try a couple things.

1) I can slow things way down and just tease her longer. I know I can pull in 15-30 mins. Doesn't mean I have to. What if I just drew out the date and really built the tension? Then for my own sake and I can get more comfortable and sink into my own desire more. When I take her home, I crank down the speed too. To be honest though, once they are inside, most are ripping to go anyways.

2) Trying two dates. Going on the first, building tension, and when I would normally go for the pull, telling her "I'd take you back to my place, but I think I'll make you wait for the second date". I've just not done two dates because if I can do it one, why not? Answer is to give myself some comfort, tension, and more screening. Worth trying out.

But really the crux of the issue is mental chatter and not dumping unnecessary expectations on myself. Easier said than done. I'll get there.
 
Bman said:
@foducossy42, yeah its just a bunch of mental chatter really. I usually give my girls a lot of foreplay anyways and will alternate chilling and playing with them. In those moments what ends up happening is I will acutely be aware of me starting to get turned on, getting hard, and then double down on the pressure.

The "new girl nerves" is definitely a pattern for me. It's given me thought to try a couple things.

1) I can slow things way down and just tease her longer. I know I can pull in 15-30 mins. Doesn't mean I have to. What if I just drew out the date and really built the tension? Then for my own sake and I can get more comfortable and sink into my own desire more. When I take her home, I crank down the speed too. To be honest though, once they are inside, most are ripping to go anyways.

2) Trying two dates. Going on the first, building tension, and when I would normally go for the pull, telling her "I'd take you back to my place, but I think I'll make you wait for the second date". I've just not done two dates because if I can do it one, why not? Answer is to give myself some comfort, tension, and more screening. Worth trying out.

But really the crux of the issue is mental chatter and not dumping unnecessary expectations on myself. Easier said than done. I'll get there.
Click to expand...

Yes it’s the pressure I think. Especially when you start getting hard and you’re like “finally, let’s get fully hard so we can do this” and then it deflates under the weight of expectations. Need to just relax. No expectations. Which is maybe why when I just chill and talk to a girl (very platonically) in my bed after having failed to get hard, I find I can just relax and then tension builds naturally from there.

Now on reflection I noticed that when I bring the girl home I’m usually standing a metre (a few feet) away from her and just talking. Super duper platonic. Then eventually kiss her. So maybe the key for me is to stop being an idiot, and actually build tension by sitting with her and kinoing her before I start kissing her. I mean sure, what I’m doing now is working well enough for the girl — I almost never get hit with LMR, she’s into it etc. But I need to think about what I need as well, and build the tension — not for her but for me.

Slower dates might work. Builds the tension more for you, basically a form of foreplay. Then your lizard brain is more able to take over.

Second date I’m not sure. It’s worth a try. I would be scared to risk it TBH, lol. I don’t get second dates if I don’t sleep with them. And a large part of my date game relies on me internalising this as fact — it makes me push to bring her home or never see her again. You seem to be able to build a lot of tension on the date, so it could work for you. My game is pretty shit, I just build comfort and ask if they want to come home with me.
 
Bman said:
Back home this girl was very sweet and very submissive, with just a tiny bit of brattiness, just enough that it’s fun and not annoying. I definitely wanted to fuck this girl, however I still had her a bit on a pedestal, so was pressuring myself to perform and show her a good time. Never works out. So cycled through being semi hard and soft and never made it to penetration. Told her I was in my head. She asked why. Told her it was just nerves, she was a beautiful girl and I just wanted to show her a good time, which puts pressure to perform.
Click to expand...

Would you be against excusing yourself to another room and popping a pill in this situation? That's what I do if it ever comes up, and in ~15 minutes I'm good to go.
 
pancakemouse said:
Would you be against excusing yourself to another room and popping a pill in this situation?
Click to expand...

Yes.

  1. I'm very hesitant about using something that could become crutch for a hard situation. I'm paranoid about doing it too often that I'd start thinking I needed it. The crux of it is pressure to perform because I'm still seeking the external validation from her that I'm great at sex. It's a habit I'm trying to break. I could see myself easily saying "better take this just in case." Being that the cause is mental, I'm more inclined to gain a mastery of myself and my nervous system. I've been able at other times. It's hit or miss and I'm still working at it. Just because it's hard doesn't mean I want to shy away from it.
  2. It gives me the opprituntity to practice being honest in vulnerable about expressing my feelings at the moment when I least want to. If I'm able to do it in then, it's cake walk on dates and everywhere else.

However, I do think it would benefit me to still have a couple on hand for break glass in case of emergency situations. Eventually I'll have a 9 lying there or be at kink event where a threesome or group sex opprituntity spontaneously arises, in which case I'd bet the nerves would probably be quite high. So as long as I set a rule for myself that I'm allowed to only use these once or twice a year, that's ok.
 
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