Fuckboy Aspirant said:
That's a regular ratio, but also you just don't have enough data. Yeah, 800 is a lot for most guys but on a macro you have to understand it's not "ok I'll hit on 800 chicks and I'm garanteed to bang 2. Yes and no, you can go through a dry spell of 1000, god even 2000 if unlucky and get 0. Then followed by a 100 approaches where you get 6 dates and you pull 5. On a macro, it evens out. It's the numbers game.
Like you said yourself and I agree with you, in the first 1000 approaches you're pretty much just learning how to play, you're not forward enough and can't capitalize opportunities. I consider this as redshirt year, as per the article by GLL. So after sometime I had no worries concerning ratios, I was just learning.
On that aspect of the girls appearance, coming from a latin american country as well I understand it, and it was definitely something I had in my mind prior to this. However what I can say is that if there's one thing CA taught is that I can never judge a book by its cover.
I've came to see that that doesn't seem to be exactly pattern of this, ugly/hot, white/black, you name it. Couldn't find specifically any link, at least when it comes to CA. They ghost and reject just the same, hence why I strongly believe now it's mostly female nature, and that has no race or whatsoever.
I'm not white, but I've been to dates with white girls, black girls, even natives. Sometimes you yourself are putting in these limiting beliefs and in turn this is reflected on your behavior whilst approaching (avoiding x type of girls, and things of the sort). Again, if that's the case, I sympathize and I've done that myself, but that's just not reality.
I agree. I'm jumping to conclusions here. I don't think it's the absolute truth, I'm speculating, we all have a tendency to create imaginary patterns. I agree that it's small sample size.
At the same time, I also think there isn't enough evidence to say that cold approach is a 'pure numbers game' and looks, social skills and other factors don't matter, even though some people in the community swear by it.
Fuckboy Aspirant said:
Like, it's really up to you. If you feel like you've "grown" out of approaching, more power to you. It's not really mandatory and if you feel like this is draining your energy and making you depressed, yeah, you don't have to keep it going.
What I can't do is just come here and say "yeah, you're justified, approaching is a waste of time and doesn't work, just go do social circle instead". It's really up to you.
I don't feel I've grown out of approaching, nor I ever will. I think my desire to approach will always be there.
What I do think is that it has become my new comfort zone. The only things I can do to grow are:
-approach higher volume. this is hard to do in a 120k town. So it's more like, I've decided focusing on daygame is inefficient until I can move to a big city. So I'm focusing on money for the next months.
-Improve my game and force myself to do things I'm uncomfortable. Meaning, improve my body language, my vibe, the way I talk, the words I use, learn to tease, sexualize, to overcome objections, change topics, lead the interaction verbally, physically and logistically, learn to escalate in a calibrated way.
I think daygame is not the best way to learn this. Which doesn't mean I think daygame isn't a good place to implement game once you learn it.
The best way to learn this is social circle, in my opinion. Why? Because you get to test things over and over until you figure it out. Why? because you are in a position where girls approach you, not the other way around, You get to see girls when they are default receptive, not default unreceptive. If you fuck up, you can easily try again.
In cold approach, you get rejected instantly most of the time, and you don't know whether you did something wrong or you would have gotten rejected regardless, and you don't know what you did wrong. You've too little exposition. You may approach hundreds of girls but you only interact with most of them for 5 seconds and that's it.
If you are an alpha male in a social circle, you also get validation, positive feedback that reinforces your identity as a valuable man that women fight for. And this is the position where all the 'game' techniques naturally stem out from.
The only way to learn game through cold approach is to go out with a cool guy/experienced wing. Which is something I also can't do until I move to a big city.
If you go out by yourself and don't have some natural predisposition, you may aswell do 10000 of approaches and never 'get it'. All while you keep reinforcing the frame of being an scarce guy that chases women on the street.
I have mixed feelings with cold approach. Sometimes I love the fuck of it, sometimes I feel weird. Sometimes I find it monotonous. But I'm not attached to it as a way to meet women.
I do resent the fact that you fight your fears and all that. But maybe it takes 5000 approaches to plate a hot girl? All while average cuck easily plates hot girl just for being part of her social circle.
So it's not about me whining and refusing to face pain or discomfort. But rather, is this the product I want? Do I really care if my lays are from cold approach or they are online? Do I care about laycount? Or I would rather have 2-3 hot regular fuckbuddies?
Is this the only way to get what I want?
What price am I willing to pay?
Would I rather roam the streets and get incessantly rejected?
Or do I prefer to work my way up the social ladder? Or change my sleep schedule to go out everyday to nightclubs and get drunk? Do I care about doing drugs if that increases my chance of fucking hot chicks? What if I actually enjoy the party lifestyle at this time of my life?
So I'm not anti cold approach at all, but why exclusively cold approach? Why don't add something else?
Fuckboy Aspirant said:
The reason I say I don't want the social circle thing is simply because I did it myself. It's not like I just decided it wasn't for me before trying. Personally, I didn't find it easier, but it might very well be because I'm not suited for it. It can happen. It didn't empowered me, I didn't enjoy it. It did nothing for me.
I didn't find it a good way to spend my energy, perhaps if I were someone who's naturally some 'people magnet' type, potentially it could have been different.
There are so many ways social circle can unfold that it's hard to discuss or measure. But do you mean by it? Going to some activity and befriending people there and waiting for some sort of signal and then make a move on one girl?
I mean actually climbing up the social ladder. Competing against other guys to be an alpha male. Or cooperating with other males or people in general and building something of value in an environment that women congregate to.
I mean actually being in a leadership position, or at least a position with some responsibility and social visibility. For example, working as a bartender, bouncer, club promoter, or hosting events or parties. Being a teacher/instructor, a lifeguard. Even something simple like driving an Uber.
Or being an artist/musician/performer/comedian and performing in front of an audience.
Or becoming big on social media.
By social circle I mean creating preselection, social proof, being in the center of attention and performing in a way that shows skill/know-how/capability/leadership/confidence.
This is definitely not what most people do (although it's what succesful naturals do).
Fuckboy Aspirant said:
Likewise, you understand I can simply flip these questions to you regarding CA as well, and it will be just as valid, right?
Yeah, but I think that after getting close to 1000 approaches I've earnt my right to question it without feeling that I'm trying to avoid discomfort. I know I can do it and keep doing it.
Fuckboy Aspirant said:
I really don't see the connection here. Yeah, maybe if by game you mean tricks, gimmicks and stuff like that, then yeah. But I talk about CA. And there's really no BS to CA, it's a numbers game. You must hit the numbers to achieve the results, that's it. The hard work is going out there and facing your rejection mileage in order to reach the positive outcome.
On that society thing, I'm sorry. I find this pathetic. If we were to go full "blackpill" on this, I guess you already know, but: society doesn't even want you to get laid. Society wants you to stay quiet, be a good slave and work until you die.
It's not a coincidence things get exponentially hard for males as time goes by. Society is trying to cuck you.
The shortcut is that by cold approaching you're bypassing certain rules that typically mediate social interactions. We get to do that since we now live in huge cities with millions of people, while before we lived in small communities where everyone knew each other.
I think that society doesn't care about you getting laid with multiple women, but I don't think it actively works against you. I think hypergamy exists. And women are universally attracted to a % of guys that have certain qualities, that are alpha males. So women only want you to get laid if you're an alpha guy, and also don't want to test if you're an alpha guy or not and prefer to not risk fucking a guy that they aren't sure about.
This is getting too theoretical, but society in general prefers you to be monogamous rather than polygamous, yeah. If few alpha males get all the girls, the rest of beta males will be angry and destabilize society. We know the story.
But it's also what happened during most of history. Emperors, kings, powerful men in general, having multiple wives or concubines or what not.
If you add enough value to the world, society will be ok with you concentrating all the women and all the resources.
There's a difference between passively submitting to society vs engaging with reality, understand how people work, understanding the rules of the game and playing by the rules to get what you want.
Most humans have an "in-crowd" bias and distrust strangers or outsiders. Most people also submit to authority figures that are socially proofed, and reject people that seem to not have authority/social proof.
Fuckboy Aspirant said:
I don't agree with this at all. I can tell you, all the matches I've had online didn't do 1% of what going out of my way, getting rejected plenty of times and having to face not only the rejections but lack of results for months did for my confidence and social freedom. It's just not comparable.
Again, this is really something that makes evident people who approach and who don't. There's people out there (even here) who get laid a lot through OLD or social circle, but are needy and fear rejection a lot. I just don't see how these things are equal by any means.
I think one thing is not fear rejection and another one is actively seeking it. Avoiding any kind of rejection is needy, but trying to maximize receptivity is a logical, natural and winning mindset. In what world facing lack of results is a good thing? Maybe in the beginning stages facing that adversity grows a thick skin in you. But it's a transitional stage, to get to something better. Wanting to forever be "on the grind" seems masochistic. If anything, you get into another type of grind and face another type of adversity.
To me actively seeking rejection doesn't seem like a winner mindset. A winner, alpha guy, doesn't care about rejection at all, it doesn't exist. He does everything to get results no matter what he has to do. He achieves outcomes by any means necessary. Does it take 10000 approaches to plate 3 hot girls? Cool. Does he plate 3 hot girls by growing an instagram account? Cool too. He doesn't care about not facing rejection since rejection doesn't exist in the first place, or is irrelevant and his self esteem remains unaffected.
Fuckboy Aspirant said:
Not quite sure on how to answer that. What I can say is that 1: I don't approach girls I don't find attractive. Not to say I only hit on 10/10 chicks, but I'm not hitting on ugly girls either. I have my threshold of attraction and I'm okay with that.
and 2: I don't put hot girls on a pedestal. When you face enough rejections, naturally there's a tendency, I've noticed, to really not care about how you present yourself and not changing your behavior to please anyone. Hot and ugly girls will reject anyways, regardless. This behavior really can't be faked.
Well, I said that since you said that as you evolve, looks become a less important factor and if "advanced" guys marry average girls, it's because they value less looks and more other aspects of personality. Am I correct?
I don't think looks will ever become unimportant to me. While not sufficient, I think looks are definitely a necessary condition. And I think a lot of times people use the "personality card" as a way to compensate for lack of looks. Both ugly women and men that are with ugly women.
I don't put hot girls on a pedestal but I want to fuck them. I don't care about pleasing them, but I do care about behaving in a way that is conducive to fucking them. Most often than not trying to please them is counter productive. But I don't think you can say anything you want and have to calibrate.
I do things that I'll probably don't do otherwise like using a self tanning lotion, or wear insoles, only to increase my chances with hot girls. Does that make me people pleasing?
Fuckboy Aspirant said:
To be quite frank, I've found this post a little bit whiny and needy/validation-seeking in some aspects.
We can spend all day talking about why women have it easier and all that. What's the point? Life's not fair, but it's not only unfairness. There's always something you can do.
Like, why do you care so much about girls "chasing" you? If you want the hot girls so badly, who cares? I also find the whole "shortcut" seeking thing as a way to avoid rejection, I might be wrong, but that's what I got from it.
Is it validation seeking to want girls to chase you? If I want to fuck girls, what's the easier scenario? the one where I'm chasing or the one I'm being chased?
Is it validation seeking to want girls to tell you you're attractive and they desperately want your dick inside them?
Maybe.
But there's some validation component to all of this journey, and to a certain extent it's healthy to want that. Gll talks about this, you need to fuck hot girls to get that shit out of your system and then stop needing that validation.
I will stop posting so much though. I'll actually walk the talk and come in a few months and tell y'all how I've been doing.
