YEAR 3: THE IRONWILL PROJECT: MONEY, MUSCLES, MINDSET - FROM NOTHING TO SOMETHING, MY RELENTLESS JOURNEY

[MakingAComeback]

Important post from King Colgate confirming Low SMV Theory:

King Colgate

https://killyourinnerloser.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=47697#p47697

MAC: Realisation of Low SMV - Facing The Music

https://killyourinnerloser.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=47626#p47626

Others

"But You Got Laid" - On Vanity Metrics:

https://killyourinnerloser.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=47638#p47638


--

We will figure this shit out, none of this will be totally unfixable, people like me and Colgate are willing to scour the earth and will stop at nothing.

The grinding in the gym will be totally legendary.

The clock is now ticking, I'll be 32 in 7 months. Time is running agaisnt me, so the pressure is on. I arrived here at KYIL at 29, a few weeks before turning 30. I have been able to make progress as we all know, but there is real work to be done. I am grateful and happy that I am not in the position I used to be, but the truth of the matter is sleeping with women you find unattractive doesn't do it for you. It just doesn't.

The task has now fallen upon me to build an exceptional physique and I will work as hard as a human being can, I will shed blood for this, because this is the only way I will find the success I am looking for.

The best time to start was 10 years ago.

The second best time to start is now.

SO BE IT

MAC DADDY

 

[MakingAComeback]

I WILL fix myself

And I WILL develop a road map for low SMV males to build a good sex life

I will develop a body of knowledge and we WILL find a way to help men achieve success if they're from low SMV backgrounds

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1T-2m11PTGCYOLUrINaF7ZtA6Au4bSdNkeERjjUrK3rc/edit?usp=sharing

So far contributors have been:
-Me
-Colgate
-Pancakemouse

I will find a way & then others from my background will just be able to repeat what I did to have success.

Now I will need the rest of you to keep me accountable and push me so I can work this shit out.

MAC

 

[MakingAComeback]

THE PHOENIX PROJECT: WEEK 53

Morning BW: 190.3 (Down 7.5lbs since I overhauled my regime 2.5 weeks ago)

ACTIONS
(1) Dating: Message 1 lead to confirm for date tomorrow
(2) Body: Core / Gym: Back & Biceps / Posture
(3) Biz/Copy

Notes:

Sleep has been pretty shit and I am processing a lot of stuff mentally, laying there sleepless all night thinking of how I can turn my situation around. Been like this for a week now tbh. To be truthful about it, grappling with things that didn’t work has caused me a deep amount of mental anguish and pain and has brought on existential thoughts and such. This is part of my psyche emerging at this time and I will work through it like I always have to.

We have to ultimately integrate our mind to be better men and at times it will just force us to grapple with things.

For some reason, the realisation that where I am, and what I am at this time, is not even close to what I will need to be in order to just achieve basic human baselines is disturbing given the work I put in. That really stings, and if I was to stop here, my life would have been a tragedy.

Because I will press forward, I am sure I will get a break at some point, hard work DOES pay off and this is written into the code of the Universe. We have to keep faith in this.

This is where you can get existential real quick and enter dark frames of mind. Thankfully that doesn’t happen in my case and I am damn grateful man that I am in the position in my life where I can still improve, it isn’t over yet, 31 isn’t ideal but it’s not 71. I still have a chance. Also, there are still things I can do:

There are still options left on the table:
(1) Aggressive, dedicated physique development (1 year process)
(2) Nuclear option: Cosmetic surgeries (Rhinoplasty)

None of this I have a problem with. If it means I am out of the situation I am in, then I’ll do it a million times over.

All I can do is take it one step at a time but at least I have a new approach I can take next year: product & mindset development.

That will enable me to delete the previous mental model of "look above average and talk to girls" and install software that will actually work. I think that is what is bothering me now, how invested I was in that damn idea.

Anyway........

Brain washing myself into success is going to be a critical piece for me. It must be done daily.

I have gotten this out now, and I have processed it a lot. I feel bittersweet about it for sure and just want to be honest about that. Now I’ve said my piece, it’s time to get to work.

No more now. Time to work. Time to keep it positive, chill the fuck out and just course correct now.

I will have to grind in the gym for a whole year next year and then in 2024 I may have a shot at a better life. It is possible, definitely.

MAC

 

[MakingAComeback]

Man, I was feeling this post right up until about mid way where I felt this impression of defeat/negativity coated in hard work. (@AskTheDom Get the axe on standby)

Because our relationship is growing, I have to do my part to make sure you continue to soar in a positive way. You're here for me when I need it, and I want to return the favor. So I have a few a few thoughts in no particular order:

1. I absolutely agree with you on the SMV stuff. The fact is there are 'macro trends' when it comes to this stuff that can define how the majority of people act towards/think about a particular demographic. Even when it comes to dating.

This actually reminds me a lot of the older, non pc version of Mark Manson's Models where he talked about the break down of different races when it comes to polarization. As you can suspect, it broke down among similar lines:

1. White men
2a Latino men
2b Black men
3. Indian/Asian men

Even in this scale, he mentioned that black men naturally incorporate the highest level of polarization because we will be instantly viewed under a positive (athletic, rapper, masculine vibe) or a negative (criminal - black men are HIGHLY associated with criminality).

Regarding indian/asian men - I think the low SMV is simply associated with the fact that there's no big, overall negative connotation with these races. I think for the most part, they're just viewed as safe. Yet the safe feeling doesn't necessarily create the polarization needed for attraction. In my opinion, I think this is not a bad place to be, but a neutral place to be.

I think the overraching theme with this stuff is that regardless of your race or SMV, you have to stick out in your own way. Like with asians, most of them are not athletic/tattooed. So for the asian man who does that, he's going to stick out. I'd say the same thing is true for indians. There's a HUGE population of them in Seattle, and most are similar: In tech. Making a lot of money. Not in shape. So if there's a jacked up, edgy indian who completely defies the stereotype, what does that mean for his SMV? It skyrockets because he's not like 99% of others in his demographic.

I say this to say, I think it's time to focus in. Just like in my thread where I got a lot of suggestions about men who look like me & how they're killing it... I think it's time to get a collage together of all the indian heart throbs out there & see what you can swipe from them. Yes, we can only control so much with our looks, but as someone has told me, I have no idea what my potential even looks like until I get rid of this facial fat.

I think a lot of this attraction stuff ultimately comes down to two things:
- Fulfilling what women instinctively associate your race with (In my case: athleticism, style, masculinity, assertiveness)

OR...

- Defying what women instinctively associate your race with (Not a threat, tech nerd, timid, etc.)

You're doing great work, brother. Like many have said here, take a sec to pull back & see the big picture. I love how open & raw you are, but when I see that undercurrent of negativity, it really makes it hard to pay attention to everything else.

Overall, I won't try to convince you that you're wrong on any of this stuff, but my hope is that you can frame it in the right way. I'm not white, but I'm not Indian so I know I'll never understand your fight 100%. We'll never understand the universe or why things are the way they are, but I do know one thing: You have the potential to become exceptional. And you will because 90% of men have no interest in doing so.

Recalibrate. Reload. Re-engage. We have work to do, brother.

Hey Nate. I took time to really ponder your post before I replied. You make excellent points.

Overall, you have posted a very sensible post, and that is great.

That said, I wouldn’t say my post is actually very negative – to be truthful, this kind of is how dating and the sexual market place is for me as an individual male.

I will keep working & perhaps it will improve.

I do not feel optimistic about this but I will have to try.

There is pretty much nothing I can do but accept it, all I can do is:

1) Work incredibly hard
2) Never give in

And repeat that, every day, whilst remaining positive as I can.

Lets see what happens man. This is one where I will just have to go off faith.

Ravi

 

[natedawg]

Lets see what happens man. This is one where I will just have to go off faith.

I love this man. Lean into faith when things feel dark/unclear.

I also recommend stopping by klondike 's thread. He recently did a social experiment that I think is worth seriously leaning into for inspiration to help see you through.

You got this.

I'll be busting my ass right alongside you because I have a LOT of work ahead of me to have any shot at competing.

 

[Thrice]

It will just be me drowning in a sea of fucking fat, lmfao!!!

This one killed mate only normies settle, and you aren't... You'll find a way
https://youtu.be/qI58UxaM7IY

 

[MakingAComeback]

Notes on today:

Did my best. Fuck me I have been sleep deprived and fucked up lately. But trying my best.

Look, there are problems I will need to find a way to overcome. I have had my suspicions for quite some time but I held off until I had enough experience. I have gotten that now.

I have found that to be honest, the big problem in my case is actually my physical appearance.

It does now make a tonne of sense and does add up. I previously thought I was about average or ‘normal’ in looks (about a 5) but I think for women’s standards I may be a bit less than that. That is what has fucked me and explains why I got what I got. But now I understand this, I can either feel bad about it, which I refuse, or I can just make plans for the following:

• (A) Develop a very good body to offset ugliness, which could bring me up to about a 5 (in theory I should be able to then get access to women who are about average which is a 5)
• (B) Start saving and planning for facial surgeries, which I can start making arrangements for in December 2023.

IMO a person does not have to lay down and just accept their lot in life.

If I was born with no arms and legs and I dreamed of seeing the world, I would still find a way.

I was born with a pretty awful appearance that other human beings do not want to have much part of, and I am still looking to build an elite life.

That is great IMO and commendable.

None of this means I am doomed for my life to continue the way it is, I still have the possibility of luck and happenstance, but I do have some fears around that.

Lets just be blunt: bad looks DOES make anything to do with women extremely hard, yes.

You won’t know until you’ve tried but do understand I am at around 5,000 lifetime approaches and kind of understand that the subtleties of my appearance, little things like the structure of my face, are what absolutely destroy my outcomes with the opposite sex.

I am dropping weight and have dropped 7lbs since I kinda understood my situation better, no real difference yet but it MAY look better in 20lbs time.

Whilst I was still able to get the lays, please stop using this as an example of success, they were quite literally gross for the most part. One was genuinely attractive and I’ve never been able to get over her.

That happened due to sheer luck, the harder you work, the luckier you can get.

Now, this was the time of my life I went all in, I will never be able to go as hard as I did for an entire year again, as such, the likelihood that I will get lucky like that is slim………

That must mean I am fucked, right?

In my estimation, I am a bit screwed. I also happen to know if there is any fucker enough of a psycho to somehow find a way to fix this shit, it is me.

I’ll find some sort of way. I may have to research other areas and possibly consult wider and see if there is something out there that can help me. I will actually stop at nothing and will find some solution in some dark corner of the internet.

For now, I will just face the facts and develop a plan for next cycle.

I have an entire year I could dedicate to self improvement ahead. I can either choose to ignore my problem and continue life as it is now, which is life as an unattractive man, basically not even worth living. NOPE.

Or I can just shut up, make other arrangements for how I pursue dating in the future, and work hardcore on developing myself to overcome the impediments I have.

I bust my ass to get here man, truly I basically killed myself, I am in no way exaggerating lol. There is no use in carrying on like this, I’ll find a way around it, there will be something I can do.

Move back on Thursday and I will take my first ever break from dating and women since I started.

I will lay off for 3 weeks and then resume in some way.

I have done my work gentleman, I have been hammering these apps every day for over a year, I have approached over 1000 women, dated about 100. I saw the entire thing all the way through.

9 lays, 8 nasties, 1 cutie.

Otherwise, ghosting, rejection, and a lotta bullshit.

I tested my product on the market and my product performed quite terribly.

We can either be a victim and lay down and rot.

Or we can pull out all the stops to be the best men we can be and just breathe our dying breath knowing we tried. In trying, we can eliminate things that DO NOT WORK.

What we now know is this:

If I carry on looking the way I do, its fucking over.

Unless I drastically overhaul my appearance and go far beyond what I was originally advised ("just look above average" we can discard for low SMV males) then I can't really complain. We have understood that the game is not fair, it is basically rigged against low SMV males, and for survival one must find a hack. Aggressive Looksmaxxing & Game. There.

You are not entitled good things in this life. Some people are dealt a fucking terrible hand and have to just man up and work through it. This shit can be an actual living hell for some. It can definitely feel hopeless, hell, in my case, I think it may be a losing mission. If it comes to that, at least I'll know I tried.

But the thing about that is, I DO have a small possibility of finding a way.

I DO have a small %,, it may be 0.00001%. That is still something and I just need to fight for that minuscule percentage.

The fact that someone looks bad in the eyes of other people is insufficient justification for that person to be unable to attempt to accomplish their dream.

I do not accept it, and will not.

My middle finger is very much raised to the world and I will spit in this cunt earth's face once more like I have done many, many times in my life.

Back tomorrow……..

MAC

 

[Manganiello]

Back tomorrow……..

Best thing you can say honestly.


Hmm ya man, admire the honesty.
I mean watching you and Sherwyn really does challenge the normal simple advice given to guys.


Curious about this tho:

have approached over 1000 women, dated about 100. I saw the entire thing all the way through.

9 lays, 8 nasties, 1 cutie

So you had 100 dates?
How many pulls?
And then 9 lays from that?

 

[RogerRoger]

I have found that to be honest, the big problem in my case is actually my physical appearance.

It does now make a tonne of sense and does add up. I previously thought I was about average or ‘normal’ in looks (about a 5) but I think for women’s standards I may be a bit less than that. That is what has fucked me and explains why I got what I got. But now I understand this, I can either feel bad about it, which I refuse, or I can just make plans for the following:

• (A) Develop a very good body to offset ugliness, which could bring me up to about a 5 (in theory I should be able to then get access to women who are about average which is a 5)
• (B) Start saving and planning for facial surgeries, which I can start making arrangements for in December 2023.

I am dropping weight and have dropped 7lbs since I kinda understood my situation better, no real difference yet but it MAY look better in 20lbs time.

Unless I drastically overhaul my appearance and go far beyond what I was originally advised ("just look above average" we can discard for low SMV males) then I can't really complain. We have understood that the game is not fair, it is basically rigged against low SMV males, and for survival one must find a hack. Aggressive Looksmaxxing & Game. There.

There's a lot that I'd like to write here. But I think the most useful thing I can write is instead an actionable question: where are we meeting up in 2023? Let me know the closest major city to you if you don't travel. If you do travel, let's go somewhere new.

If you'd like to expand on why I'm proposing that, it'd be largely my comments on the quoted section above.

 

[colgate / bulldog]

If I carry on looking the way I do, its fucking over.

i have the exact same impetus lol

 

[MakingAComeback]

Back tomorrow……..

Best thing you can say honestly.


Hmm ya man, admire the honesty.
I mean watching you and Sherwyn really does challenge the normal simple advice given to guys.


Curious about this tho:

have approached over 1000 women, dated about 100. I saw the entire thing all the way through.

9 lays, 8 nasties, 1 cutie

So you had 100 dates?
How many pulls?
And then 9 lays from that?

Hey man, great seeing you again. How have you been?

Yeah but that's OK man. That advice works for most people. 95% of guys here WILL find success just following Andy and Radical advice. Thats a good thing man.

Sadly for guys who are not what women want it is a different story. But that's life sometimes. It's a bummer and to tell you the truth I don't think I will ever get over it. Until I am dead I will just keep trying man. It will probably be a very exhausting and combative life and I will have to resist this until the end. There is no other option

Yes. 9 lays from online dating. 1 was nice, the others were not good.

Pulls, I'd say 4 pulls outside the 9 lays which didn't convert or go anywhere.

I have found that to be honest, the big problem in my case is actually my physical appearance.

It does now make a tonne of sense and does add up. I previously thought I was about average or ‘normal’ in looks (about a 5) but I think for women’s standards I may be a bit less than that. That is what has fucked me and explains why I got what I got. But now I understand this, I can either feel bad about it, which I refuse, or I can just make plans for the following:

• (A) Develop a very good body to offset ugliness, which could bring me up to about a 5 (in theory I should be able to then get access to women who are about average which is a 5)
• (B) Start saving and planning for facial surgeries, which I can start making arrangements for in December 2023.

I am dropping weight and have dropped 7lbs since I kinda understood my situation better, no real difference yet but it MAY look better in 20lbs time.

Unless I drastically overhaul my appearance and go far beyond what I was originally advised ("just look above average" we can discard for low SMV males) then I can't really complain. We have understood that the game is not fair, it is basically rigged against low SMV males, and for survival one must find a hack. Aggressive Looksmaxxing & Game. There.

There's a lot that I'd like to write here. But I think the most useful thing I can write is instead an actionable question: where are we meeting up in 2023? Let me know the closest major city to you if you don't travel. If you do travel, let's go somewhere new.

If you'd like to expand on why I'm proposing that, it'd be largely my comments on the quoted section above.

Hey Roger, good to see you here. You used to post in my log when I was obese and it's great to see you here again.

I would be happy to meet up. I am currently in London, but will leave here tomorrow. Thereafter, I'll be heading back to my parents for a while to be honest with you to focus on business and body. I will probably cold approach, though there's no volume out there, and will come to London regularly to see my friends. I will keep working hard as humanly possible and possibly my life will get better if I am able to find a solution.

It would be great to meet you and get to know you more. I see you're in Germany? I've visited many times and really like Germany a lot, my best friend Dave was born there and we have done a lot of travel and tourism there exploring his roots.

You're welcome to expand on this if you wish, but you don't have to, I've met tonnes of guys from here and some of my close friends I met from this forum.

Ravi

 

[MakingAComeback]

If I carry on looking the way I do, its fucking over.

i have the exact same impetus lol

Yep. We'll accept it in time bro.

We will have to remain positive and stay strong.

There will be a way, some solution exists out there in the cosmos, somehow we will find a way.

Ravi

 

[MakingAComeback]

THE PHOENIX PROJECT: WEEK 53

WED 14/12/2022

(1) Dating: Will ask this lady if she’s down for a date tonight, she rescheduled and hasn’t replied. If she’s down, fine, otherwise this will be it for a while
(2) Body: Core / Gym: Back & Biceps
(3) Biz/Copy
Others: Self Improvement Process & Reading

Notes:

Will keep pushing. Going back to my parents tomorrow, and will wrap this chapter up.

I’ll keep working. Will check in later.

MAC

EDIT:

I was 189.5lbs today. First time I've been below 190lbs since I was 21.

 

[MakingAComeback]

.....Yeah that date went ahead and flaked after rescheduling yesterday.

Couldn't catch a break could I, lol.

It would have been epic if I could end a dry run of 5 weeks of dates and no lay.

There will be some sort of lesson in this and it will teach me something. If nothing else, it is admirable that I pushed until the bitter end, literally the day of moving out.

All good. TIme to clear everything and just sit down and work.

MAC

 

[Holden]

MakingAComeback dunno if you keep up with my log but three girls flaked on me just this week. There's something in the air for sure.

Regarding your reply to my post: fair enough man. I admire your resolve and work-ethic and there's no doubt you'll make it, by any means necessary.

 

[AskTheDom]

It's mid december from here till xmas the flakes will avalanche
Also girls will tend to be more involved with orbiters that are potential BF material as you know, it's holiday season, just to get drunk on NYE and start all over again

 

[RogerRoger]

There's a lot that I'd like to write here. But I think the most useful thing I can write is instead an actionable question: where are we meeting up in 2023? Let me know the closest major city to you if you don't travel. If you do travel, let's go somewhere new.

If you'd like to expand on why I'm proposing that, it'd be largely my comments on the quoted section above.

Hey Roger, good to see you here. You used to post in my log when I was obese and it's great to see you here again.

I would be happy to meet up. I am currently in London, but will leave here tomorrow. Thereafter, I'll be heading back to my parents for a while to be honest with you to focus on business and body. I will probably cold approach, though there's no volume out there, and will come to London regularly to see my friends. I will keep working hard as humanly possible and possibly my life will get better if I am able to find a solution.

It would be great to meet you and get to know you more. I see you're in Germany? I've visited many times and really like Germany a lot, my best friend Dave was born there and we have done a lot of travel and tourism there exploring his roots.

You're welcome to expand on this if you wish, but you don't have to, I've met tonnes of guys from here and some of my close friends I met from this forum.

Ravi

Hey Ravi, nice to know your name now

Awesome you're focusing on body + business! Honestly that's my focus now too (mostly business-side, but I've learned in the past year life isn't worth living without some bare minimum exercise).

I could visit you in London sometime (you mentioned you'll go out to London periodically?) or if you want to visit me in Germany that's cool too. Depending on what business you're working on (I guess it's product dev but idk what that is tbh) maybe we can make the trip business-first and approaching-second. For example, I was already thinking of hitting up Dubai at some point in 2023.

One more actionable question since we probably won't be meeting very soon: have you read think & grow rich by napoleon hill yet?

 

[Brother_Tucker]

Hey MAC,

I started reading some of your posts. I can see you've been at this a while, so for reference I've read your first post (where its clear you have made some major progress) and the last page or so. I say this in case I'm missing something.

I get a real negative feeling and outlook from reading your posts. You mention that you're starting late and wish you found all this in your mid 20s. While it would have been a benefit, the key thing is positioning yourself for hitting you peak by your mid 30s. As long as you do that you will find everything comes easy and is fun. You still have plenty of time and you should stop worrying that you started too late.

Secondly, I see that you're super dedicated to getting into shape. That's great, some of your previous posts imply that you might end up falling into gymcel territory. You don't need to drop everything else to achieve your goal, it helps to have a focus but you don't need to go too extreme. Looking at your profile picture, I cant imagine that you're not getting results as you are currently (I think you're at 9 lifetime lays at this point, all in the last 2 years?) From where you were this is a huge positive. You mentioned that the best girl you are picking up is around a 4, just so I can get a baseline of the 3 girls posted below, can you say out of 10 what you think they are? These are just some I pulled from instagram:


View attachment 1
View attachment 2
View attachment 3

I just want to see how your 4 compares to my 4 before going deeper on that point.

 

[pancakemouse]

Hey MAC,

I started reading some of your posts. I can see you've been at this a while, so for reference I've read your first post (where its clear you have made some major progress) and the last page or so. I say this in case I'm missing something.

I get a real negative feeling and outlook from reading your posts. You mention that you're starting late and wish you found all this in your mid 20s. While it would have been a benefit, the key thing is positioning yourself for hitting you peak by your mid 30s. As long as you do that you will find everything comes easy and is fun. You still have plenty of time and you should stop worrying that you started too late.

Secondly, I see that you're super dedicated to getting into shape. That's great, some of your previous posts imply that you might end up falling into gymcel territory. You don't need to drop everything else to achieve your goal, it helps to have a focus but you don't need to go too extreme. Looking at your profile picture, I cant imagine that you're not getting results as you are currently (I think you're at 9 lifetime lays at this point, all in the last 2 years?) From where you were this is a huge positive. You mentioned that the best girl you are picking up is around a 4, just so I can get a baseline of the 3 girls posted below, can you say out of 10 what you think they are? These are just some I pulled from instagram:

Having seen some photos of the girls and listened to around 10 of his dates, the issue with the girls is less about their attractiveness and more about their archetype: he seems to exclusively attract comfort girls with very low sex appeal who are looking for something serious. The four girls you posted seem like they fuck in various amounts — his don't. This is the main reason for the low conversion rate from dates recently.

I suggested adding Tinder to his repertoire, and completely redoing his profile to add edge.

I agree with you that he should be getting results with his photos, but for whatever reason they just attract the most useless timewaster kind of girls, at least on Hinge.

 

[Squilliam]

Having seen some photos of the girls and listened to around 10 of his dates, the issue with the girls is less about their attractiveness and more about their archetype: he seems to exclusively attract comfort girls with very low sex appeal who are looking for something serious. The four girls you posted seem like they fuck in various amounts — his don't. This is the main reason for the low conversion rate from dates recently.

Doesn't he do screening though? Why is he still getting all these girls if so?

(Granted, I know that there are no screening methods that will get rid of 100% of the leads you don't want, but it should still be a fair portion)