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colgate - FINALLY!!! i get my first daygame lay!!! after 3 years!!!

I've said several times in my log that approach itself is self-therapy. So here we go with the next issue that I've discovered from approach.

I did a couple of daygame sessions last week but they were all pretty half-assed. I don't remember most of them exactly but they were like maybe 5-7 approaches each. I also did some nightgame sessions, probably 5-10 approaches when I did go out each time.

I had another instadate the other day. We ate at some hipster health food place and paid for our own meals. Main detail about this instadate is she asked if I was gay. I flatly said no and then she said she wasn't looking for a boyfriend, which I didn't respond to. She talked for 75% of the instadate and then I made a half-assed attempt at having her come with me to my street and chilling. I could have pushed more but I let her comment about whether I was gay get to me too much.

Later that night, one of Troy's friends matched with some chick on Bumble and they were going to meet that night. I was roaming the streets approaching when I heard some girl calling out to me from somewhere. I look up and see lacroix with some chick. I go to the venue and meet them and we talk for a bit. The chick says she is here to meet some guy on Bumble. Turns out the guy she is going to meet was Troy's friend. lacroix manages to actually pull her to his place and kiss for a little bit but he doesn't get much farther as she keeps resisting with "I'm here to meet that other guy from Bumble", so he kicks her out eventually. Then she and Troy's friend end up meeting eventually.

I mention this story because this Bumble chick asked Troy and his friend if I was gay too. When I was told this, my immediate reaction was chucking my open Gatorade bottle in the air. 2 girls in 1 day called me gay???? wtf???? Troy probed a bit further to the girl about it, and she was just like "I don't know! like his voice and vibe!", and not much beyond that.

Coming off as "gay" isn't a total surprise to me. I've heard it at various points in my life. Rags2Bitches and some of his friends also told me recently the same, mainly that I am acting way too eager. I also have some of the voice inflections that gay guys have. I'm not sure how I picked it up, but I can tell you I was actively suppressed from doing anything "male" as a kid because of my hyper-religious mom. She refused to let me play baseball on a team as a kid because it would get in the way of church, blocked me from looking at any TV shows with swords/"violence", always talked about how evil karate and other martial arts were. She even didn't allow me to play Pokemon because it has the suffix "mon" in it which means "monster" and monsters mean Satan. Additionally, most of my socialization from childhood was from my mom's friends, who were older women and I don't remember having any male role models or being around a lot of other guys as a kid.

Additionally, I'm naturally attracted to girly/feminine energy. I like pretty girly music, anime girls, and some of my style choices recently ended up being sort of girly. The types of chicks I'm into are super cute Asian girls. I'm not drawn to most "masculine" things in general. Initially, I was like "how is this gay? I literally like girls and feminine things." I don't think I'm wrong with asking that question, but the problem is that girls aren't gay either. Most girls aren't going to be attracted to someone who expresses a bunch of feminine energy and has girly interests. I could probably get away with liking these things rather than being some meathead who likes to watch college football if I had more outwardly masculine traits to counterbalance it, but I don't right now.

I didn't think "acting gay" was that big of a dealbreaker. Like I knew enough about myself to be aware of the above, but I really didn't think it was some huge deal. Actually, I was really pissed about it over the past few days. Like that's why I'm not getting girls? Really? I'm too gay? But if it really is so, then it's something I have to deal with.

It seems that this "acting gay" issue isn't some deep internal problem, rather it's just a surface-level technical issue that I can fix. The most obvious things I can think of doing are getting some kind of voice coaching and joining a combat sport. For voice coaching, I've done some internet searching but the most I've found is "female to male trans voice masculinization". I wonder if that would help me, despite not being an FTM trans person. If anyone here has done voice coaching, let me know some recommendations.

I'm really open to any suggestions people might have about this because I'd really like to fix as much as possible about it before school starts on January 17, when I'll have real cold approach volume again.
 
KillYourInnerLoser said:
Ask yourself this: "Why do I care so much if a couple people think I'm gay?"
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This isn't a matter of "caring whether people think I'm gay". I've mentioned the above about my outward demeanor as something I've known for a long time, and that I didn't really care/think was a big dealbreaker at all.

The degree in which I outwardly act "gay" is high enough that it actually takes a toll on my results with women. It's analogous to being fat or not knowing how to dress. Yeah of course you can get some results without hitting the gym or improving your style, but you can't deny it helps with those.

My post was mainly to highlight that now it's something I'm aware of that I should work on, asking about ways I can learn to "act less gay", and steps of action I can take towards improving this.
 
Look at masculine role models. Model some of their traits. Look at your traits that people say are overly feminine and try to make them more masculine. It's all a work in progress. Chris said that the feminine girls always like the masculine guys the most. But of course that was 10 years ago and times change, and what's in changes, but the girls you like doesn't.

As far as voice goes. Every frat guy I've ever heard basically fakes it. They try to fake how deep their voice is. Whenever I hit on a girl my friends say I basically try to make my voice deep. I can show you over a phone call. At least my best attempt.
 
Just sign up for Laz's voice bootcamp. Tell him I sent you.

On a more serious note, the best you can do is record yourself trying different tonalities. Then play them back and decide which sounds better. From there, you should practice it till it becomes an automatic thing.
 
I think you know this, but to sum up the issue, it's not that girls think you're gay, it's that they think you're not traditionally masculine, which they crudely interpret as gay because they don't know any better.

I really like Sonny Arvado's vibe/voice:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daj2vDe5iXs

I have a lot of uptalk in my voice as well. My best female friend is a valley girl from LA, and after living with her for many years I found that I was mimicking her accent.

Recording my sets constantly helps me.
 
I'm going to leave Austin this week. The university delayed school by 2 weeks due to homocron, and that means they'll probably just indefinitely delay it. And even if they don't, I'm feeling tired of Austin already and I don't like approaching at the shopping districts much (inconsistent volume, fewer girls my type, group sets so not IDable, etc). I've already been on a bit of an action hiatus and don't want to wait much longer.

I have some plans but rather than revealing them here and getting some kind of validation for having a plan, I'll post about it as it unfolds.

Daygame
Saturday 01/09
0#/11 in ~1h

Sunday 01/10
0#/7 in ~45m

My volume has been pretty abysmal so far this year (I've probably only done <30 approaches including my sessions above). I've noticed my approaches have become quite awkward as a result. Usually when I go out to approach, it takes me like 5-10 approaches to "get in the zone" and clear out any lingering anxiety with social interaction, but combined with low volume and not going out of my way to approach recently, my "sessions" this weekend were quite awkward.

Online
Been messaging some matches (like 3-4) but haven't gotten anyone to meet up. I've been trying to figure out what kind of conversational style to do rather than just using a template. Main reason is I've gotten some girls to actually talk for a bit, but so far I've gotten ghosted when I inquire her schedule/meeting up.
I've also been taking photos with lacroix. We've probably taken 300+ photos each of each other.
I've also discovered the value of online dating is that it's a good supplement for when you can't get cold approach volume. You have a bit more freedom of location if you can set up a good online dating profile, versus cold approach which depends on living in a place where you can consistently meet lots of girls in person somehow.
 
Well its a shame I didn't make it to Austin in time for us to troll all the ladies. Yeah its funny my volume was super low to I think I'm at 4 approaches, but I didn't approach the first weekend. Oh well, make it up this week.

Yeah online is good as a supplement. Yeah the ghosting happens online and offline. I've only had success in trolling people with online dating, but that's a story for another day
 
colgate said:
I have some plans but rather than revealing them here and getting some kind of validation for having a plan, I'll post about it as it unfolds.
Click to expand...

What an open loop! Excited to see where you end up. I agree that Austin is just not the place for daygame.
 
Drove into Phoenix Tuesday night and staying at AirBNB. I'm leaving Sunday. Reason I came here is because some guys from another group planned a gamecation over the weekend, and I saw it as a great opportunity to try to relive my Nashville week back in late September, since I have nothing to lose. Don't expect any action from me after this week though, going to see my parents again in California after Phoenix, since I haven't been over there in nearly 2 years. I have a bunch of plans to figure out what exactly I'm doing next which I'll focus on there and try to catch up on work a bunch for a bit since dating has eaten a lot into my life over the past 5 months and I haven't exactly figured out yet how to balance everything yet. Hopefully it'll be 2 or 3 weeks tops and I'll be back sometime in February logging again once I get my plans sorted out and in action.

Took 2 tabs of ecstasy in the morning. I tried it for the first time on Saturday night and realized it's the best drug ever. I don't feel any sort of "high" or disassociation/stimulation, it's just normal. But after maybe an hour my brain somehow goes into overdrive and I can drill extremely deep and quickly into pretty much anything I can think of.

Switch flipped from resentment to gratitude towards my mom
Not relevant to dating, but relevant to my self-improvement journey. Skip this section if you're not interested.

For some reason, I spent about 2-3 hours thinking about feelings of resentment towards my hyper-religious and dogmatic mom. I won't go into too much detail of the specifics as I believe it's irrelevant to my log and it's also public, but I'll talk about the relevant parts of the situation with respect to my own self-improvement journey. I ran away from my mom's house when I was 16 and basically never spoke to her for about 8 years, other than visiting her maybe 3 times out of obligation, and I basically avoided talking to her as much as possible and always was miserable when I did visit. In that time period, my mom would incessantly spam my phone with texts and I'd ignore most of it or give short answers, and I ignored literally every call from her since she used to spam call me as well. Actually, with my realizations this morning, I have a pellucid awareness of how cruel I was, but I didn't realize it during that time frame. Anyway, around summer of 2021, I realized closing off all contact with my mom meant I just shut the door of trying to work out my own personal issues so I had a serious talk with her for the first time since probably 2012 and was able to set some boundaries of "you stop spamming my phone incessantly, but I'll make sure to call you every weekend and we can have short chats". Been doing that every weekend since then, usually calls are around 20-90mins. Also, I had a latent and kind of crude awareness that her intentions were good when raising me, but she just didn't do it correctly. Had no idea why though up until this morning.

I used to think my mom just saw me as this abstract idea of a "son" and raised me accordingly, without actually trying to understand the kind of person I am and adapting her parental strategy accordingly. The realization was basically I straight up didn't realize how fundamentally different I am from my mom. Since I had no awareness of that as a kid, I never even telegraphed that knowledge upon her and how she could have adjusted. Basically, given that fact, it was impossible for my mom to adapt to me, due to no particular fault of her own, rather it was just a totally bad roll of the dice between us. Realizing that, and also knowing that she did have good intentions and in no way did I ever view her as evil, all of my resentment vanished towards my mom and the only thing that remained was gratitude. Told my mom I loved her for the first time in my life and actually meant it.

Daygame
60+ approaches over 4 hours. 1 instadate, 1 same night date, 0 pull. 15 contacts including a LINE and snapchat.

Felt really good immediately into start of session because of above long story about my viewpoint of my mom. Thought I would have a bunch of latent anxiety from doing jack shit over this year so far and would need 5-10 approaches to "warm up" but somehow I didn't.

Actually to be honest I have no idea how many approaches I did even within a 10 range. I kind of made up this figure from guessing that I think I approached at a slower rate than I did in Nashville (usually 20-35ish/hr) but faster than Austin (10ish/hr). My primary focus of the session was literally trying to get an instadate, rather than purely "number of approaches". Approach count almost doesn't even matter if you can go up to any girl you please, so I just approached whomever, tried to get the ID, and then maybe went for the exchange if I thought the girl was super hot or I liked her personality (lol gaaaaaaay) and then approached another girl. I walked away without asking for exchanges from most girls if I felt they were being lame in our chat but somehow still got a massive positive exchange tilt anyway, thought I had maybe 6 or 7 contacts tops during the session.

Also ended up evolving a new behavior with regards to being hyper-pushy, without having it be some big event where I spam the girl repeatedly with pushes like I did in Nashville (though I had my priorities inverted there. asked instadate maybe once or twice tops and then pushed for contact robotically). Current strategy is something along the lines of if a girl declines the instadate, maybe push once or twice more depending on what the girl responds with, and then continue talking for a bit and make small talk, then bring up the idea again after a little while and repeat. I think I did this on nearly every approach where I wasn’t instantly deflected. Rather than “spam pushiness”, it’s more like just sprinkling them throughout the conversation. Very fun and you can get creative based on the context of the conversation, plus it’s a great unlock for getting past occasional moments where you perhaps “blank out” during the conversation, because you can just throw in another push and you automatically figure out what you might say next concurrently, or based on the girl’s response to that.

Asked girls what they were up to and if they immediately had class went for exchange (usually without pushing). Told some girls my type to skip class and come get boba tea and pushed that a few times when I felt like it. Otherwise, I probably pushed most girls on average 3-5x for an instadate before getting bored and walking away without saying anything. Some girls I pushed at least 8x if they didn’t seem lame as fuck and then went for exchange. Hardly pushed any exchanges because it’s like, okay if you’re going to decline the instadate repeatedly *and* also decline my exchange, then you’re just lame, see ya.

Had one girl who was super super duper short (maybe 4’9” or something) decline my instadate request repeatedly over a couple minutes of conversation with “I have homework”, but she was so short I really wanted her, even though she seemed kind of lame. Transitioned into asking if she knew of any other good cafes other than boba tea place and she said there’s a Starbucks nearby. She told me she could show me where it was, initially I pushed again and said yeah okay we can grab a drink there, declined again and was about to walk off but decided to roll with “okay just show me where it is”. We walked for maybe 3-4ish minutes and had a chat, then we arrived at the Starbucks. Tell her she needs the coffee because she’s going to do homework, only 10 mins etc. Keeps declining. Some random guy walks out of Starbucks and asks us where the nearest bathroom is. I just tell him to go that way towards some random building and say most class buildings have bathrooms, even though I have no fucking clue what I’m talking about and he runs off. Pushed girl maybe a few more times and then walked off without saying anything cuz her lameness finally surpassed her shortness.

I decided to take a girl's snap for the first time because I just want to start experimenting with it. I know it goes against most dating advice I've seen here, but I want my own data. Will only take snapchats from girls who don't somehow seem totally lame to me but refuse to exchange phone numbers for whatever reason. I'm curious as to whether girls age 18-22ish see snapchat (and perhaps even instagram?) as their standard chat platform rather than phone numbers (similar to how Japan tends to use LINE and China uses WeChat). But I still usually decline snaps and don't bother exchanging anything with most girls, so it'll be rare and only when I sense the girl isn't acting lame as fuck. This snapchat in particular didn't ghost me on first message so we'll see where that goes.

Dates
Instadate
Got an instadate on my 4th approach somehow. Girl told me she was up to nothing, but then while we were walking to taco place she was saying she had a class in an hour. I was actually hungry and wanted to eat tacos so I didn’t cancel the instadate. I bought tacos, girl bought nothing. Girl had really cute and feminine personality but she would not stop talking lol. Went for pull a few times after I finished tacos in maybe 10-15 minutes. Basically told her to skip class, and she should be spontaneous, etc but wouldn’t budge. This is a highly unlikely scenario and likely a waste of time, but it’s what I ended up trying anyway since I only agreed to the instadate because I just wanted a quick bite myself. I told her we should meet after her class and she agreed, though I texted her 2ish hours later and didn’t respond. Then she responded at like 9:30pm lol.

Same night date
Approached Asian chick with a mask but didn’t look ultra ultra my type or anything. Seemed pretty unreceptive and weird about my approach. She also kind of looked sick or something actually for some reason. Asked her about it and she was just like “uh, I don’t speak English” and was about to accelerate away. Recognized her Japanese accent in how she said ingurisshu, so I immediately switched to Japanese. 3rd lifetime Japanese approach lol. Immediately her face lit up and started being super chatty. Decided to actually talk with this girl for like 6 minutes or so for whatever reason before going for ID again but in Japanese this time. Told me she just got back from Japan and was waiting for her luggage from her mom. Pushed her to come with me anyway maybe 2-3x but she wouldn’t budge. Then I said, how about we meet later after you get your luggage. Actually I don’t remember if she or I suggested exchanging, but we exchanged LINEs. Hit her up maybe 2 hours later, she told me she was still waiting, so I just told her to let me know when it does come. I sent that message with the expectation that she wouldn’t respond later and I wasn’t planning on texting her for the rest of the day after.

But she ended up shooting me a message 2 hours after that around 8:00pm that her luggage arrived. So I told her “ok, let’s go for boba” and she said ok. I skated over to the boba tea cafe and arrived before she did. Ordered my drink and sat down. She arrived maybe 5-10 minutes later and waved at me. Waited for her at the table while she waited in line for a bit and ordered her own boba and she sat down.

She took off her mask and I was like wtf????? She was actually way cuter than I thought. I actually literally told her (in Japanese btw, so just guesstimating what I actually said), “Wow, you’re really cute without your mask” and she giggled. Decided to be like “I literally wasn’t sure if you would be cuter or uglier without the mask and I couldn’t tell when I saw you but I decided to approach you anyway.” She laughed at that and I was just like “you gotta take risks in life sometimes, you know”.

Conversation was 50/50 Japanese and English and also weird Japlish hybrid at some points. My Japanese is rusty because I never use it. I occasionally spoke in English when she randomly spoke in English, and then randomly switched back to Japanese. She was really bubbly and energetic on the date. Went for music pull after 15-20 minutes, but she declined with “I have to do homework omg it’s so much blah blah” “just do it later we’ll hang out for 30 minutes and I have to do work after” etc. Kept the convo going for a while in between random pull attempts based on the conversation, and probably tried over 15+ times over 45 minutes or so.

She was like “I installed HelloTalk after you told me about it earlier today” and we talked about that for a bit. Told her I knew how to use the app so you can get to a basic conversational level in around 6ish months. She’s like “omg teach me!!!!!” But rather than telling her how to use it there, I used it as another opportunity to pull with “I’ll show you at my place” “omg no I can’t show me right here” “no it’s a secret unless you come with me” etc.

Also attempted to pull to her place like “Let’s go to your place. I’ll help you with your English homework that you have”. She declined that because she has a roommate living literally in the same bedroom as she does, so I guess that wouldn’t work. Then said “well how about you do your English hw at my place” “I don’t have my backpack” “we can walk over to your place and grab your backpack and then head over to mine” etc, but declined that as well.

At some point, don’t know who suggested it first but the idea of meeting up later again this week popped up. Told her she should meet me directly at my Airbnb, and she agreed. I probed her week and she said she’s free Friday afternoon, so I sent her my address and then I ended the date with “I have some work to do”.

She immediately put her mask back up as she was getting up out of her chair so I didn’t try to go for a kiss. Happened to be in same direction for a couple blocks so we talked and then hugged goodbye. So let’s see if she actually meets up on Friday.
 
colgate said:
Otherwise, I probably pushed most girls on average 3-5x for an instadate before getting bored and walking away without saying anything. Some girls I pushed at least 8x if they didn’t seem lame as fuck and then went for exchange. Hardly pushed any exchanges because it’s like, okay if you’re going to decline the instadate repeatedly *and* also decline my exchange, then you’re just lame, see ya
Click to expand...

I see you mention this "pushing" a lot. Maybe it's just my experience, but almost all the sex I've had had required very little "pushing" to overcome resistance from the women I've been with. At most, if a girl rejects my invitation back to my place, then I bounce to another venue and try again. After a second rejection I end the date.

Maybe I'm missing out on tons of sex that I could be getting if I pushed my rejections harder, but it doesn't feel like it.

I don't remember reading anything from GLL or Andy that says "not enough pushing" is the reason a guy isn't getting laid. In fact it feels like the opposite, I know Andy has mentioned this article before:

Let me ask again: Why would you ever be excited to be with someone who is not excited to be with you? If they’re not happy with you now, what makes you think they’ll be happy to be with you later? Why do you make an effort to convince someone to date you when they make no effort to convince you?
Click to expand...

https://markmanson.net/fuck-yes
 
Ed_ said:
colgate said:
Otherwise, I probably pushed most girls on average 3-5x for an instadate before getting bored and walking away without saying anything. Some girls I pushed at least 8x if they didn’t seem lame as fuck and then went for exchange. Hardly pushed any exchanges because it’s like, okay if you’re going to decline the instadate repeatedly *and* also decline my exchange, then you’re just lame, see ya
Click to expand...

I see you mention this "pushing" a lot. Maybe it's just my experience, but almost all the sex I've had had required very little "pushing" to overcome resistance from the women I've been with. At most, if a girl rejects my invitation back to my place, then I bounce to another venue and try again. After a second rejection I end the date.

Maybe I'm missing out on tons of sex that I could be getting if I pushed my rejections harder, but it doesn't feel like it.

I don't remember reading anything from GLL or Andy that says "not enough pushing" is the reason a guy isn't getting laid. In fact it feels like the opposite, I know Andy has mentioned this article before:

Let me ask again: Why would you ever be excited to be with someone who is not excited to be with you? If they’re not happy with you now, what makes you think they’ll be happy to be with you later? Why do you make an effort to convince someone to date you when they make no effort to convince you?
Click to expand...

https://markmanson.net/fuck-yes
Click to expand...

I elucidated on what "pushing" entailed in my previous log. Also it ends up being on the same line of reasoning as "solving the girl's problem" as KillYourInnerLoser has mentioned on his podcast, since it's not necessarily spamming, rather assuming the girl wants to continue the interaction and trying to veer the trajectory of the interaction in that direction. At least in my head anyway, but it's the first time I've really done this style.

Also, I've realized the same as you about "fuck yes or no", which is why I stopped taking a lot of contacts and walking away from girls who seemed like they didn't want to meet again at all (lots of excuses, etc).

Yeah, by all means maybe what I'm doing right now is actually not even worth the effort, but I've found few "fuck yes" girls so far. Also I've often seen girls initially act "fuck yes" and then devolve down to uhhh...idk...i can't....etc (so basically no). I have a lot of conflicting data points on not "pushing" past 2x because pushing past 2x implies unreceptiveness. Certainly the percentage of girls who would actually convert over from hyper-pushiness is quite low, but it's certainly not zero. And I don't feel I have anything to lose with the girl so I haven't found a reason not to experiment with this. I think the best example of the more "pushy" style actually working on the forums is Manganiello's cold approach lay in Toronto.

The general trend I have observed is that guys who say don't bother with trying to be pushy and just focus on finding the "fuck yes" girls tend to have an abundance of the "fuck yes" girls. So of course it makes sense not to waste your time with being pushy. On the other hand, I've seen other guys convert quite a bit from being pushy, far more than I am. Given these data points, you could theoretically optimize in both directions for results (in other words, figure out how to increase the amount of girls you meet to say "fuck yes" to you and be sufficiently pushy with girls whom you perceive as "on the fence").

But that begs the question, how do you increase the percentage of "fuck yes" girls towards you? I'm genuinely curious and would like to know.

EDIT:
Read the Mark Manson article you've linked since it answers my question. Yeah, it's definitely self-improvement. I'm pretty aware of that also. Not saying this from any kind of adversarial point of view, as I've identified many things I need to work on about myself outside of specifically dating which would improve my dating. I think I tend to talk about those often on my log here. It's also something Troy and I have talked about at length in Austin. I have a bucket list of things I need to work on and much more to think about regarding myself and turning into a guy more girls my type want to date (haven't written logs about it here yet, probably will in the future). But thanks for reminding me about it again so I keep it in mind.
 
Manganiello said:
Like what?
I know bulking is one of them.
Click to expand...

Going to pull a Chris from GLL and just stream-of-consciousness list anything I can think of over a couple minutes in rapid-fire succession like he did here: https://www.goodlookingloser.com/laid/index/this-process-will-strip-you-down-and-force-you-to-confront-your-demons

Bulking, having a structured routine, working on being socially aware + developing better empathy, not being overly eager, having a more masculine way of speaking, being someone who can defend myself and others, having a sexual vibe, competition anxiety, staying engaged in a process

Won't go into too much detail on any of these specifically yet because they usually end up unfolding as my life progresses, and I'm not a fan of "listing all my goals out" ahead of time because it's never really worked for me.

Main thing I need to focus on after this week is putting myself in the right environment to continue my self-improvement/dating progress over a more sustained period of time instead of just darting around the country (I've moved twice in the past 4 months), and I've realized that destroys any sense of basic structure for self-improvement, since it involves getting there + settling down + setting up your life again. If I were to have been in Nashville still up until this point with an unburnable college campus (or other place with high approach volume) I probably would have had much faster progress than I have had so far. Back in Nashville I was doing great with the gym+bulking too because I had it down to a routine. Moment I left Nashville that basically fell apart, and by the time I got back into it, I decided to move again (hence why my bulking log has been dormant again).
 
The universe has given you an abundance. You need to push all the other puppies in the litter aside and suck all of the milk from the teat. Doesn't matter if you're the smallest, weakest, ugliest, whatever puppy. You drink all the milk, you'll be the biggest and the best.

The above was from some motivational video a guy showed us pregaming in his hotel room and it really stuck with me.

Daygame
Thursday 1/13:
Roughly 45 approaches over 2.5 hours. Again, just totally guessing because I lost track after like 7 tops once the volume started getting high. Mix of high and low volume. Good amount of instant deflections (confidently says I have boyfriend, not interested, etc) unlike Wednesday, including girl I literally made direct eye contact with and stared at after walking away from a previous girl during high volume who was instantly "not interested" without me even approaching her. Like, yeah exactly.

3 intentional reapproaches, including Japanese girl I went on date with Wednesday. These were girls I'd already exchanged with who had ghosted me up until that point. Just "hey, what's up" for the most part and then pushing for ID + probing logistics for regular date again like any other approach.

0 instadates. Same deal as last time. Pushed 3-5x for it over short convo. If girl was off to class, I would have some kind of extended conversation and had many that lasted over 5+ minutes. Mainly had extended conversations because I wanted to gauge whether I thought the girl was cool or lame. I actually walked away from one girl who kept making busy excuses for future plans despite talking to her for a while. Basically in general if girl seemed lame, I'd walk away without bothering to exchange as usual.

5 numbers, 3 snapchats. Just winged it if I wanted to grab number or snap. If girl was in a hurry or something, usually grabbed snap since it's quicker to scan her QR code than stand there and type her number in. I noticed with my limited data set I was actually chatting with more of the girls I've exchanged snaps with, so I think snap vs number doesn't actually matter much, especially since I think younger girls just think snapchat is a messaging platform. Just exchange any form of contact as you please. Doesn't matter because you'll likely get ghosted/excuses at the same rate. It's just a numbers game and eventually one will hit and she'll meet up. What's also interesting is despite me picking up almost triple the amount of contacts yesterday as I did today, I got ghosted by nearly all of my contacts yesterday, while most of my contacts today responded and we're chatting. It's almost random.

I want to make a quick point about rejection. After probably ~1100 lifetime daygame approaches so far, I've ended up unintentionally reframing "getting rejected" as "this girl is making excuses and is lame". Like, I've inverted the paradigm. I don't even see "rejection as mileage" necessarily anymore. It's just, most girls are lame as fuck, but occasionally you'll find some cool girl you vibe with whom you'd actually want to continue an interaction with. That's why I've been able to walk away from many girls without bothering to take their contact, I'm like, what's the point. I don't even like this specific girl now and there's plenty of other girls I'd rather talk to. I'm acting as I please and if the girl doesn't like it, there's another girl who will like it. This isn't to say I should not improve myself and my personality should be static, but rather, I'm not trying to get the girl to like me. I'm seeing if I like the girl beyond her appearance.

Date
second date + pull + no hookup
Second date with Japanese girl from Wednesday. I don't think I've had a second date with a girl since like my 2nd-3rd lifetime approach ever back in September so that's interesting. We met Friday afternoon for some pho. Didn't need to seed pull as we'd already agreed to come back to my place after, so it was just "let's go" after 30 minutes or so.

I hadn't really made much physical contact with her yet so I decided to do hyper-beta thing of "hey let me show you how to skateboard" since we'd talked about that. So I had her balance and try to push herself off of my longboard and kinda made sure she didn't fall. That lasted probably around 5 minutes.

She had already said she had to go at 5pm to do more homework and we arrived at my place around 4:15. I was aware of the time constraint I had.

She came in my room and I locked the door. Sat on edge of my bed but refused to take off shoes or mask. It's like, I'm the only other person here but let's leave the mask on. Anyway, she kind of came here under the premise of "me teaching her how to use hellotalk" from our first date, so she immediately pulled out her phone and started talking about it. We talked about it for like 25+ minutes and I was mentally jamming myself trying to get her to sit farther back on bed or try to escalate in some way, while also engaging in a conversation. That was my main fuckup, I started the pull too long with chatting, rather than engaging in an activity where we could chill in silence. Maybe I should have talked about it for 2 minutes tops and then I would have had more time. Also I should have just sat farther back on bed where I wanted to and kept my frame instead of trying to sit near her, perhaps.

Anyway, when I finally realized what was happening, I switched the activity to listening to music. Girl still wouldn't come farther back so I sat next to her and like immediately put my arm around her. But it was too late because it was already around 4:45pm. I tried just pulling her mask down and she was like "no! no! no!" and then said she had to go do her homework. I was afraid of causing a big scene in my room since this is an AirBNB with 3 other people so I didn't push anything (I didn't realize there would be other people staying here before I booked the place). Walked her outside my place, tried to pull down mask again, same "no! no! no!" so I just walked back into my place without saying anything.

Usually I escalate within 2-5 minutes but that's because we're doing some activity that involves chilling in silence (like listening to music). But I learned that if we're doing something that involves chatting about something at my place, I won't be able to escalate because I'll mentally jam myself. On first date, I was just trying every possible scheme I could come up with to get her back at my place, without that awareness. But next time, I'll be wary of that, just make sure it's something that's not chatting a bunch at my place, and if it is, transitioning out of that as quickly as possible.

Nightgame
I met up with a bunch of guys from another group I'm in and also lacroix once again for a nightgame session last night.

Tempe is great for nightgame, it's probably my favorite place I've been to so far for night. Great vibes and extremely high volume on the weekend (though low volume during the week). I highly recommend visiting for a weekend if you're into nightgame. Lots of cool games, great music, and girls are cute af.

Did probably around 15-20 approaches total last night. I winged one guy named Rick from the group who's extremely good at nightgame. Rick tends to have a lot of cool novelty items to interact with girls with, such as weed glasses, fuzzy scarf, and harmonica. It's a viable strategy for nightgame especially if you aren't already super jacked/sexual yet to open girls. I've come to understand over roughly lifetime ~300 night approaches that literally saying a single word to a girl at night means you're hitting on her. So you can say anything you want, just make the approach and get shit happening. For a girl at night, she doesn't care about being complimented, she's out to have fun. So a value you could immediately provide to the girl is fun, and then you can just escalate from there.

Got a bunch of instant deflections, which was standard and good. Also some conversations/dancing here and there.

At some point, Rick was showing off his skill at the boxing game where you try to punch this bag as hard as possible. Rick's not jacked or muscular at all, he looks more like Michael Phelps, quite lanky. But he does jiu jitsu professionally, and figured out the technique for this specific boxing game and gets around 800+/1000, beating many guys who look beefier and stockier than he.

I had never tried this boxing game in my life, so I gave it a shot. Gave it a punch but I think I kind of missed the bag and literally got 1 out of 1000. Literally the lowest possible score. At this point my brain went into overdrive. I was thinking about the video Rick showed us during the pregame about how you need to push all the other puppies aside and suck all the milk from the teat. If anything, I need to do that more than anyone else. So I got to work.

Immediately after, I literally just opened some girl with like "holy shit!!!! I got a freaking 1 on that boxing game, look!!! what the fuck hahahaha!" Chatted with the group, occasional hints of trying to shoo me away, but I just kept talking with them and acting as I pleased. There were a bunch of friends meeting up with this girl so I just introduced myself to each girl, as if I already belonged there. Some girl was sharing her Ritz crackers with me lol. Eventually this whole thing kinda disbanded and I did some more approaching around the dance area.

At some point I eventually had Rick's scarf, so I started incorporating that into getting girls to dance with me. Like putting the scarf over them and dancing with a bunch of them. I found that I got a good amount of girls to dance for a little bit and grabbed some asses here and there.

There was one duo with a tall white chick and a hot af half asian chick who was slightly taller than I (probably 5'8", i was 5'6.5" maybe with my boots) hanging out by the bar. Hot af, so I approached with scarf dance. Some brief dancing, but she kept trying to make excuses to get me to go away, and the friend did the same. I just kept telling myself "No, Fuck this" over and over. I want this. Some other guy even approached the white girl and started talking to both of them. I was so pissed, like "No, Fuck this" again. Managed to separate the half asian girl from the white chick and kept dancing with her. Twirled her around a bunch and got pretty close. Friend kept trying to pull her away, straight up ignored her and kept dancing. I just kept pushing like an asshole. Eventually went for a kiss and we started making out a bunch. Girl kept making excuses that she had to go, and I straight up ignored her and kept doing what I wanted. Madeout again. I tried to isolate her away from friend like "let's go to the first floor" and she made even more excuses and wouldn't budge despite me repeatedly pushing. I probably should have just taken her and probably could have even just spammed "just 5 minutes, just 5 minutes" but I didn't think to do that. Finally just decided to exchange snap with her and go approach some more girls.

Scarf-dance approached some other girls, couldn't get very far with any of them. Then I ran into the half asian chick whom I made out with prior maybe 5-10 minutes later. Was straight up like "I thought you were leaving." She's like "yeah I am!". Anyway danced with her some more and repeatedly pushed isolating her but wouldn't budge again. Madeout some more. Eventually I left again without saying anything.

Literally had sensory overload shortly after this and had to call it a night from there. Like, not necessarily from the music and lights (although that may have exacerbated it), but rather how much shit has changed for me over my week so far in Phoenix and I had to try to process it so I couldn't continue approaching even though there was still mad volume.

This chick was probably the hottest chick I've made out with, I think 6th kiss of my whole life? Like wing-eye makeup and super cute. Also I came to a realization that it doesn't mean jack shit, just as much as grabbing her contact doesn't mean jack shit. She kept acting the same and being lame with making excuses even though I managed to escalate up to making out multiple times, a first for me at night from an approach, and I only had 2/3 of a shot of alcohol the whole night. Reason I just kept pushing is because she was so hot and I really wanted it. I probably pushed for what I wanted in some way over 25x throughout our interactions. You just have to keep pushing the interaction as much as possible and then if she still won't budge, just go approach others.
 
colgate said:
After probably ~1100 lifetime daygame approaches so far, I've ended up unintentionally reframing "getting rejected" as "this girl is making excuses and is lame"
Click to expand...

Value here. My exact thoughts. When I leave after pushing for ID, I don't feel that I got rejected or did something wrong. I feel grateful because I didn't waste time with a lame chick.
 
Smashing it with those approach blitzes my man. 1100 is a great number to learn a LOT. Your mindset optimises over-time (or at least it should).
 
Nightgame
Maybe 30+ approaches, 20+ instant deflections. Some conversations and dancing, but girls ran away before I managed to escalate. Dunno if I was too slow or just mostly lame girls.

Rick messaged our group chat at some point that he pulled+fooled around with this chick. He was like, anyone who potentially wants a threesome come find me. I was like, shit okay and decided to look for them. Literally went up to his hotel room at first but they weren't there. Later ran into them in line.

I decided to just hang around and see what would happen. Rick ended up telling this girl to makeout with me. So we did. She was like 5'9" and white. Then Rick was like "I gotta get this on snap/video!" so we madeout again.

I'm really glad I got to makeout with that hot half asian chick last night because I made that happen all on my own. And it made this one feel like "lol whatever okay who cares" since it was literally just given to me.

Honestly, her personality was kind of grating and she was acting ultra masculine. Reminded me of many chicks in Austin whom I met around my apartment.

We were trying to hook her up with lacroix so we went up to his hotel room. She also "chose" another guy from the group whom she wanted to hook up with, and we ran into that guy later, and he came with us. Plan was to just leave them in hotel room with lacroix, and then Rick and I would bounce.

So we did that, and then later even lacroix was somehow super turned off by her as well so he left shortly after. She ended up hooking up with the other guy, and some other guy in a threesome. Then later she hooked up with yet another guy in our group.

Before I started going balls to the wall with dating, I was kind of like "omg kissing, wow!" But now I've kind of been seeing it as just some other escalation step. Like it's not a huge deal anymore. It does really get me aroused though and puts me in the mood with a girl though.

Anyway, leaving Phoenix tomorrow. Will be taking time off from focusing on dating for a while to catch up on work and sort out an environment where I can better make sustained progress over a longer period of time instead of just darting around the country. I really like Phoenix though and would consider visiting here in the distant future, it even seems like a great place to live.

ps: I got 846 on the punching game today. Way more proud of that, as I literally got 1 yesterday. Took me a couple rounds of getting 700+ but I finally got a decent score. Also I think I may have pulled my bicep doing another round after the 846 haha.
 
colgate said:
Rick messaged our group chat at some point that he pulled+fooled around with this chick. He was like, anyone who potentially wants a threesome come find me.
Click to expand...

You guys are into some crazy shit :D Having a devil threesome is something I am still not sure whether I want to try it. Some part of me finds it very intriguing, another part of me is disgusted.

"push other puppies aside, suck all universe's milk"

I like your motto. Fuck the sheep!
 
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