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Gabriel's log

February 8th

Approached 20/20 women got 1 number from a girl with boyfriend.

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I almost never get creeped out reactions anymore. Usually girls smile or laugh. So I think I have the relaxed, social and happy vibe going on.

What I lack now is more authority. Women don't stay long in the interaction, they're rushing somewhere else, etc. So I need a more commanding voice, more certainty, speak louder and more fluently, with better inflections.

Fox Legends Program: 8%
 
February 9th and 10th didnt do anything. Got too gecky with theory stuff and that puts me in a non action taking mode. My main problem RN is laziness or lack of energy+living half an hour away from downtown.

I'm literally too lazy to move my ass there.

Besides, I subconsciously know that I have to go to the same place over and over and I need to get used to being "that guy".

February 11th

Did 21/20 . Got 2 phone numbers.

I'm getting good at approaching more difficult scenarios, like older women or women with kids. Heck, I approached this gorgeous redhead with her 5yo daughter and got her instagram. She seems crazy but she's so hot and the vibe was good between us.

Good eye contact is so fucking important. It's not just staring, but actually trying to "connect", with people through your eyes, which means, your eyes need to respond to the eyes of the other person.

You're not doing your solo act from memory, you need to react and adapt to other people.

Most people make eye contact when they listen but break eye contact when they talk.

It's basic nlp, people tend to look up when thinking about images for example.

Make a conscious effort to use the eyes of the other person to think, like you're looking through them.

You can create lots of "comfort" through good eye contact and smiling/laughing. This shit is obvious to me now lol

---
Besides, I still need to be more dominant and masculine.

What seems helpful for me to channel that masculine energy is to get into a state of anger. Anger is masculine.
Now I understand what Chris meant with "aggressive". It's not just about being "direct", but also being aggressive and high testosterone and high energy. You need to talk like you're the fucking boss.

But in much more levels that you think are even necessary. You need to understand how low is the bar for masculinity nowadays and how much masculine energy you've been repressing

Which means being "direct" is not only a matter of the words you say, but also your body language and your behavior in general.

When most people, including myself, try direct game, they parrot the "direct script", but the attitude is still timid, weak and wavering.

Which of course creates the wrong impression.

This doesn't mean that you shouldn't have some "wit" in the way you open or in the way you close.

It's just that in most cases that "fake directness" is an excuse to let go of the responsibility of the interaction, to throw the ball to the girl and make her decide. So you can comfortably say "She rejected guys".

You're 'dealing with rejection' instead of 'dealing with desire'. You're trying to 'make the ho say no', which means you're 'incorporating defeat into your intent' and assuming a 'sea of rejection' All of which is the broken script and not how winners think.

AA is not only about approaching but about how you approach. High AA not only means not being able to approach high volume, but also not being able to do it aggressively. Most techniques or tactics that work, require low anxiety in using them.

You need to learn to cross boundaries. That's what alpha males do.
 
February 12th

0 approaches

February 13th

Nothing

What the fuck I did: lots of theory research movie body language analysis

Studied Al Pacino/Tony Montana on Scarface lol.

Important notes:

- He doesn't "register" rejection. Doesnt take a no for an answer  He just keeps going

- He has a solid script. He knows perfectly who he is and what he wants.

-All he has are his balls and his word. His masculinity in other words.

-He often doesnt answer questions directly. He changes topics or answers a question with another question.

-Doesn't laugh at other people's jokes. Completely unreactive.

-He often skips minor/immediate authorities and goes straight to the major authority.

-He doesn't comform with what he has. But at the same time doesn't "chase" success. Success comes to him.

-He has a powerful representation of the world. The world is a giant pussy waiting to be fucked!

-Money->power->women

-He often flips the script. He's the one evaluating other people.

-Occasionally compliments people. It comes off as genuine and high value. He isn't envious of other men.

-Talks well about his bosses when talking with other organizations, even when he has bad things to say about them. If he talked bad about his boss, it would have a negative impact on him aswell (his boss made the decision to hire him). Defending your boss or your product comes off as loyal which is high value.

-He isn't afraid of losing deals. Prefers to get no deal rather than a bad deal. Willing to say no to opportunities. Which puts him in a powerful position.

-Plays to win. Willing to take risks. Isnt afraid of death.

-Doesnt give a fuck about seducing the boss' girlfriend. He shits where he eats  without concern about cosequences.

-He quickly reads people. He knows who's weak, who's not trusworthy.

-Is a transgressor of other people's rules but has his own moral code.

-Is super protective of his little sister in typical latino fashion "all women are sluts except my mother and my sister"

-Body language: expands, is loud, uses his hands to talk, touches other people, strong eye contact. Although he is more of a sigma type. He has a bit of an anxious "drug addict" energy (moves fast side to side with his body). Strong eye contact, although it comes off as cold and aggressive (eyes wide open, doesn't blink, doesnt smile) He changes objects in an environment to serve a purpose.

He often gets angry, which makes him dominant, although it distances him from people close to him.

I also studied John Anthony's Occam's Razor but haven't finished it yet.

What I'm coming to understand is that there's no way in hell you can absorb all that theory at once. You need to choose 2 or 3 concepts and practice them over and over. You should probably practice for 2 or 3 months exclusively how to open properly before learning anything else.

February 14th

5 approaches

Feb 15th

Went to a Fox Web Academy zoom meeting. Need to complete the course.

12 approaches, but pussied out on a lot of approaches at a bar. My night AA is still high. I feel more observed in close environments. I also feel lower status at night.

Believe me I don't want to be "that approach guy" . But what helps me is having the idea of moving the fuck out of here. If things go south, I always can move. And I mean it for real.

Being willing to move is empowering.

Always create options for yourself.

I think I was wrong about opening. Open frontally always. Otherwise it's a weaker open. Yes, you should watch girls from the corner of your eye and your approach should be casual and spontaneous. But as soon as you make the split decision of approaching, you quickly go frontally, with decision. It's just, you dont go frontally from 20 meters away, you do it in the last moment.
If she's stationary it's ok to do it sideways. Since she's sitting, she cant run away easily. Plus approaching fromtally in situations where she is physically "trapped" can add some discomfort, although this is just a theory.

Sexualize in your mind. Try to imagine what kind of dirty things you'll do to her

There are a million factors to consider. This is why you learning game takes years and you need to practice over and over. And doing the right moves takes balls.  It's easier to do a weaker approach.


------

Went to a "luxury" car dealership in my city and did the "smell the leather" excercise. Basically, you go see an expensive car or house or whatever and act as if you were the customer. It's challenging since you internally know you are full of shit and can't afford that. And it also estimulates your desire.

I went to see a $24000 bmw. It's not that expensive really but it's the best I've got in my city. Sitting inside that car felt super cool though.

When I go to Buenos Aires I'll go to a Porsche dealership or something

---------

Went to a Rosicrucian Center (similar to Freemasonry). They hadn't started meetings this year yet, but had a deep talk with a guy there.

This shit produced me high anxiety in the past mainly because of all the conspiracy theories that sorround it.

I'm a very skeptical person. But something incredible happened during/after this talk

I reconnected with 2 girls I approached in the past. 1 girl I found in a bar. Another one sent me an audio (although she was inviting me to a crypto talk, so it's not a real opportunity). A guy whom I talked to when I was working my sales job also talked to me offering me something. This was all in the span of less than 1 hour. And exactly while I was talking to this guy

It seems crazy and by all means it can be random, but when you make moves in the world stuff starts to happen to you.
 
Feb 16th

Woke up 8:30am
Cold shower
No fap
Went to gym

2 approaches. Hardest part for me is making the decision to do an approach session.

Feb 17th

10 approaches, 1 number. But I'm actually in Buenos Aires so 10 approaches is shit volume. I could talk to girls in the middle of the subway etc but I'm scared of everyone overhearing the convo. Fuck that

Weather suddenly went cold and rainy, that impacted my mood negatively. I also wasn't wearing my best clothes.

I'm still dependant on my appareance for good self esteem

Studied John Anthony

I completed 80% of Occam's Razor.

I will probably post my notes of Yohami John Anthony and my coach here. That+GLL+Dude75 notes is more than enough material to crush it. The hardest part is to actually implement it and change your identity.

Once I finish Occam's Razor I'm gonna go hardcore on Fox Web Academy and start implementing it asap. I'm running out of money.

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My recent lay ghosted. I'm trying not too think too much about it, but I definitely made mistakes.

Mostly, I was too boyfriend material on the second date. I didn't read her properly. Not banging her on second date was a big mistake.

My logistics suck. As far as I was concerned, there were no sex hotels in my city. But there's actually one. I went there the next day to gather info. It's kinda far away, a 15-20 mins drive away from downtown. But it's doable.

At the time of the date I thought my only option was a car pull again, but the date was during daytime. I also thought about pulling her to a gas station bathroom but I cunted out. Now I regret not attempting to pull.

I wouldnt say I completely fucked up, but I was definitely suboptimal.

And it's hard to get good when you only fuck 1 girl in 150-200, and you also fuck that girl only once then she ghosts.

This is the feedback loop thing I often talk about and Yohami When you suck, you don't get enough feedback on how to improve. So you suck forever. If you're good, you keep getting positive feedback that builds your self esteem and also teaches you how keep the attraction going, which is the real challenge and game actually starts. Normie seduction advice (like Robert Greene's Seduction) assumes you already have romantic or sexual opportunities coming to you, and for good reason. If you're forever at a stage of working your way up to get new leads, there's something dysfunctional about your life.

You learn some lessons when you get rejected, but the other 50% you learn when girls chase you and you reject them. I only had this experience when I was the only heterosexual male in an art class with below average looking chicks.

I was a giant pussy back then but still, that happened to be a social situation that positioned me as a top guy totally by chance. I was never able to emulate that again. I was just starting to read Red Pill books, working on myself, etc. I was a virgin and low self esteem, but I saw how looks, socioeconomic differences and convinient preselection worked in my favor.

Now that I think about it, even in high school I had more chances than now. The only difference is that now I'm less of a pussy than then and take more action. But the opportunities were there. Even if my smv was lower, I was more introverted, etc. Social circle gifted me female attention. And I wasnt even cool nor masculine. Imagine what it would be like for cool guys?

It's unbelievable that no matter how much money you have in the bank, you can't buy the sex life of a cool guy in high school or college (you can pay prostitutes at best, but you cant buy genuine desire). It's truly a unique period of life where sex comes easy, along with fun and drugs.

Something that isnt brought out often in game discussion is that western society up until recently was based on christianity and monogamy. The acumulation of money and capital really makes sense in the context of a nuclear family, for the purpose of improving the quality of life of your offspring, and their offspring.

Money is definitely not everything in life, although almost everything is money-like. It's just another currency. In some places it's money, in others, it's about coolness, status, knowledge, peer group approval. More intangible stuff.

Hook up culture is more of a recent counter cultural phenomenon.

So why the fuck I'm writing about all this?

I really think roaming the streets nearly  every day, for months, to hook up once,  usually with an average girl and maybe a hot girl is not the right move.

This is not what I signed up for.

For me, it's effortless harem of hot girls or bust.

Any effort that I make has that outcome in mind. Any work that I do now has the goal of building the frame that's able to generate social circle, preselection, etc in the future.

So why my main goal is money now?
Money has different qualities at different quantities of it and different stages of your life.

When you are mid 20s, live with your parents in a 3rd world country, earning $5000/month with a digital business is completely life changing. You can't buy a sex life directly, but:

-you can live almost anywhere in the world you want, with good logistics
-you can buy designer clothes
-you can pay for a coach to help you
-You can pay for tinder platinum, photoshoots, etc  you can easily create multiple profiles with multiple boosts, with male model photos, John Anthony style
-you can live in a big city where online.  dating and approach are more efficient you can travel to any city and meet game experts.
-you can buy free time to party all day like an animal
-you can pay for as many activities as you can that can get you access to a social circle with hot women
-time to build social media prescence (+money to buy ads, bots, etc)
-earning money definitely boosts your self esteem across the board

Besides becoming time and location independent type of "rich", some of my last silver bullets are:

-getting a job with social visibility in nightlife (such as bartending, promoting or being a bouncer. As a way for make money they dont even make sense for me, it makes much more sense to freelance or create a small business, but I see it almost as a volunteering gig that helps you get access to the incrowd of nightlife). Maybe money allows you to skip this and buy a table, go to a vip section, etc.
-Go back to university, but with the specific goal of organizing parties at my house. Instead of approaching girls for sex, I can prospect like a promoter of my own event.
-couch surfing, meetups, hostels. Again, it doesnt make sense to me as way to live my life. It makes more sense to think it as an something that I do for fun, while being able to afford living in good conditions. Like those rich kids that go homeless.
-Activities or classes such as yoga or dance. I already signed up for acting lessons and I think it'll help hugely in of itself
-Sex clubs, swinger clubs, etc. I'm really curious about it, since you get only the sexual outcome without all the other garbage that may not interest you, like you probably do get in regular nightlife (alcohol, drugs, distraction). It does seem like a modern solution that allows outliers to live a polygamous life, while also living like a functional adult and not at a forever party stage
-Acting in the porn industry? I'm definitely not eager to do that, but if it gets you access to hot women, definitely worth considering.
-Go back to music or art and start playing live/doing expositions. Reconnecting with high school acquaintances might help me achieve this.
-learning how to organically grow social circles in any context. The most realistic way I believe is to befriend somebody that already has access, like a club promoter, the singer of a band, venue owner, etc.

---‐------


I need to relax. I read the post and man, I sound so cringe. "Effortless harem od hot girls".

I don't know what impression you guys get from my huge walls of text, but I take myself too seriously. I need to be more chill/laid back.

At the same time, I've been fucking around with game for almost 5 years and I've gotten nowhere.

The fact that I'm excited about banging one cute/hot girl means this shit is not normal for me and my default is being a loser. I need to stop seeking so much validation. People smell it and it's lame. Banging hot girls should be my normal.

This isnt rocket science. This should take 6 months max to figure out. The fact that It's taking me so long means I'm an idiot, socially handicapped, or both. I need to chill 10 degrees, humble myself, learn from the real pros and start putting in the real work.

Work like a motherfucker when it matters. Dont work when it doesnt maters

Stop hanging around with losers
 
Sisyphus said:
That+GLL+Dude75 notes is more than enough material to crush it. The hardest part is to actually implement it and change your identity.
Click to expand...

Radical recently asked me if I have any Dude75 style posts saved. If you do have any, DM him if you will. He'll appreciate it.

Sisyphus said:
And it's hard to get good when you only fuck 1 girl in 150-200, and you also fuck that girl only once then she ghosts.
Click to expand...

I had those numbers last year before I realized how important environment is. Take any guy who boasts a decent conversion rate and put him in a busy shopping street with people promoting/selling shit, and his numbers will plummet.

So if you want to get good during the actual approach, I wouldn't worry about volume. Instead, talk to "easy" targets. Girls who are sitting or standing in place. No moving or, God forbid, girls who are in a rush.

Sisyphus said:
I really think roaming the streets nearly  every day, for months, to hook up once,  usually with an average girl and maybe a hot girl is not the right move.

This is not what I signed up for.

For me, it's effortless harem of hot girls or bust.

Any effort that I make has that outcome in mind. Any work that I do now has the goal of building the frame that's able to generate social circle, preselection, etc in the future.
Click to expand...

High volume cold approach WILL make you a monster in social settings, as long as you are not socially retarded. No question about this. So I still think it's a great SUPPLEMENT to what you want to do.

The problem is that, to get laid, you also need other things working in your favor that you might or might not be able to control.

i got a few other thoughts as well but don't got time to share them now
 
Sisyphus do you have all the posts? I only saved one of them. The styles are out of date but i loved the way he wrote and how he tied things to social and dating. Had as much impact on me as Chris' style guides
 
Radical said:
@Sisyphus do you have all the posts? I only saved one of them. The styles are out of date but i loved the way he wrote and how he tied things to social and dating. Had as much impact on me as Chris' style guides
Click to expand...

No, I wish I had. On his gll thread you can read some of his posts. He deleted everything. But he was quoted by other users . Those quotes weren't deleted. And there's a link to a bunch of podcasts ln soundcloud he made back in the day. I think that is more than enough to summarize his stance on "game", how to fit in the club scene, etc. I pasted most of it somewhere, but you can read that on his thread on gll aswell.
 
February 18th

Did 5 approaches. Went to a nightclub but pussied out on a lot of approaches.

Crisis_Overcomer
I was thinking about this when I was in the nightclub.

I think approaching and getting laid are different goals.

I've met naturals and people offline that absolutely good with women but can't cold approach.

And there are also a lot of guys that can cold approach high volume but have shit results.

So it's like bodybuilding and powerlifting. Similar but they transfer to each other much less than one would think.

At this point I desperately want consistent results with hot women. And from that position of abundance I want to keep on getting ballsier, more emotional resilient, etc.

Cold approach humbles you a lot. I think it's comparable to a blue collar job. It's frustrating, monotonous. And then sometimes you hit the jackpot. Yes you can improve your ratios. But still. It's not the best position to game. Why would you put yourself in a disadvantageous position? It's also a bad position to learn.

The best mentality for me to cold approach is 'dying with dignity'. GLL had this video called "la resistance". It's simply doing the best with what you have. It's definitely better than pussying out.

But I also keep in mind that this is transitional. I'm getting out of this chasing position. I'm moving to the top and center.
 
February 19th

Hung out with friends, didn't approach 

February 20th

Epic approach session

Probably the best approach session I've ever had. Had so many highs and lows, had moments where I felt cool, then moments where I felt awkward, off, insecure, low status. 

I met my coach Gaston in person. Met at Plaza Francia first at 5pm, then Plaza Serrano until pretty much the morning of the next day.

I made like 30-40 approaches total plus a few approaches I did earlier. Got 5 phone numbers, but they're of no use really since I'm leaving today. If I played my cards better I could have pulled to a hotel.

At this point interactions become a blur but these ones stand out:

Woke college students

First one, Duo 22 year old students. One blonde and chubby, another one darker skinned and better looking. The interaction turned into a debate about coaching vs psychology, including a debate about David Goggins. This interaction wasnt important game wise but it was pretty significant on a mental frame level.

I come from an humanities background so I carry a baggage of marxism, psychoanalysis and feminism. It took me years to get rid of that crap.

These girls werent budging. 

The main point of debate was: coaching establishes metrics for success and failure and shoots for high performance even if the person feels like shit. 

Psychology's aim is the well being of the patient. And that's ambigous as fuck. You cant measure happiness. And, branches such as Psychoanalysis, don't even establish a concise, logical definition about anything... 

There's no definition of a mentally strong person.

And the most important dilemma: you can be physically strong, mentally strong. But what for?

Myself, and most people in this forum I assume, agree on the basic premise that it's an obligation to fulfill one's maximum potential.

The waste of potential is a complete tragedy. Success, winning, is an end in of itself, even at the cost of not feeling nice.

Most psychologists think not only that there's no point in achieving success, but also that it's pathological to be obsessive or deeply focused on work or self improvement.

If you let your mind think about whats the point, it will always arrive to the conclusion that theres no point to anything. Which is the whole myth of Sisiphus thing.

But what if you put a gun to the head to all these people that think there's no point? They'll do whats necessary to survive.

And that's the tragedy. Technological progress and comfort, that is supposed to be something good, made for our well being, actually facilitates our laziness.

The brain is programmed for survival. It will always try to save energy and do nothing, unless there's something that endangers our life.

Which is one of the reasons why it's hard to create a business, instead of working a 9-5 where your boss tells you what to do.

Gaston was more firm in his frame. I was trying to establish a common ground. Eventually Gaston triggered one of the girls and she started crying. Then he left. I stayed in there a few more minutes almost being a white knight. Then said too bad that he upset you, but he's my friend and I'm choosing this way of life. Bye.

Women are so manipulative in their crying. 

In essence, I want to completely distance myself from "academic intellectualism". And I realized why while talking with this girls. That shit carries so much negative energy. Specially for me.

Massive venezuelan Tiktok girl

Venezuelan duo. One of them was a tiktoker with 13 million subs (yeah, wow, that's more people than a lot of countries), and she was hot (not super hot but hot), the other one wasnt good looking and was shy. Gaston was excited about this. You don't get to talk one on one with a "celebrity" this often. He's starting to shoot content for social media for his coaching business, and networking/bringing girls like that to talk on a video or podcast would improve his metrics dramatically. 


I told her that I disliked her tattoo, that it was badly done. This was on the limit of being uncalibrated. But she admited before that the tattoo artist fucked up. So she said it first. I think this was good. It was 'neg' that appeared naturally, from me. Those are the best. At one point we discussed about favorite animals and the type of energy people have. “People that like cats are more quiet/introverted than people that like dogs”. And we established what kind of energy each one of the girls had (the tik toker being the more “outgoing”, or “bad” one).

Then we discussed which one of us had which energy. And they said that Gaston was the “bad one”. That kinda hurt my ego. I hate to realize that girls see me as a nice guy, no matter how many tattoos I have, or how many girls I approach. Tiktoker girl had such a “slut energy”. She wasn't arrogant (well, she was a little bit when she gave out her social media). But she had this confident, super relaxed, disinterested vibe. Like “I don't give a fuck. Been there, done that. I've seen it all”. Normal girls are usually slightly nervous when you cold approach them. That girl didn't give her phone number, only her instagram.

Epic improvised talk at public transport

After approaching in Plaza Francia, we went to eat something. I payed of course (abundance mentality!). Then we headed to Plaza Serrano. As we waited for the bus, we did some freestyle over a backing track. This was extremely useful to gain verbal fluency, being more loose, etc. I'm gonna do it more often. Then we did some fake fighting. Again, super useful to get into state. And then we did some public speaking on the bus. I wanted to do this for a long time, but for the longest time I was scared. I still am. But I was with a wing, I already had social momentum, I was traveling. So it was easy. Improvised a talk about public speaking and evolutionary hard wired fear. People liked it. Again, this was completely transformative and I'll do it more often.

I was also asking people where they were from, what good places to go out were around here. Asking for cigarettes (one of my favourite hobbies!) Talked in english with tourists. I felt a natural at this point!

2nd Tiktok Duo

2nd tik toker interaction 18-20 year old duo (don't remember). One was a hot chick, very young looking, studied marketing, had a tiktok following of (only) 130k. The other one was cute but she was my type (dark skinned, shy, femenine). They were chill. Gaston, as usually, led the majority of the interaction. He managed to get tik toker girl to be massaged.. He's good at it, and she liked it. Then she massaged him, she was good at it too and she was attracted. She started saying “Do you go to the gym? You have a well developed physique” Damn. Meanwhile I was talking to my girl and there was good chemistry too. I massaged her but I wasn't that good. I felt into the frame of needing to “know-how” to do it. But the issue was, I did it with indecision. No bueno.Then we compared arm's size with Gaston. Tiktoker girl# said “Do you measure it often?” (Or something like that). Damn, what a naughty girl. We could have expanded so much here, missed opportunity. I could have told her “Yeah, but we are looking for another person to do it. Guys get jealous so they get the measurement wrong. We need a girl to do it. Would you measure it?”

Then we switched to sexual talk. I'm sexually inexperienced, so I felt insecure, and I closed off a bit during that conversational thread and it probably showed through. I also felt insecure about relationship/drama talk, since I never had an actual relationship. At one point we discussed again the “energy” of each other. Tiktoker girl was the “bad one”. And Gaston was the bad one. Tiktoker girl said I was “quiet”, “chill”. I don't know if this was negative, but I took it as feedback to my vibe. I'm boring. I don't cause enough emotion. It was the second time a girl said it, and in both cases it was a “bad girl” that said it. So it's probably true. They are measuring me against other guys and putting me in the nice guy category.

Tik toker#2 girl was savage. A class slut, at that young age. At one point she said “I think guys are clueless. You can easily fuck her best friend and they won't notice it” (I'm paraphrasing). Jesus. And she said it like it was the most normal thing. What a fucked up thing to say. Although we were debating with Gaston that sometimes young girls like to talk shit but are actually inexperienced. Could be. But man, she sounded so overconfident.
This actually was a brutal red pill moment. I mean, you see those “confessions” type of instagram videos where girls completely remorselessly admit that they cheated on their boyfriend, etc. But when you approach, you get to see glimpses of this in person, for yourself. It's brutal. I'm not a huge “red pill” guy, and I get that a lot of these manosphere gurus never go out of their house and have mental problems. But a lot of that red pill shit is true. Women and hypergamy are brutal. You think you're redpilled, but as you gain experience you keep swallowing the red pill more and more.

We should have put a limit to the bullshit that this girl was saying. That was a test. If a girl says something obnoxious or inmoral, make her shut the fuck up. Make a “dissaproval face”, Like “what the fuck”?

It was a failed test. Some girls will start saying increasingly obnoxious shit just to test how much you can tolerate. And we both failed to call her out on her “evilness”. I don't want to sound dramatic, it isn't helpful. I know women say obnoxious shit when they are in party mode.
And the dick measuring thing? We should have escalated hard!!!!!!!!

Damn, I pussied out. I should have gotten phone number from my girl. I should have escalated. Maybe I could have isolated her, led her, made a logistical change. I did nothing of that, wasn't forward enough, wasn't prepared.

You always should mentalize yourself before a session, to pull a get laid.

Lost girl

She was sitting wearing an oversized hoodie, on the entrance to some appartment. Her clothes made her look overweight but she was actually slim, small, with a very cute face. 8/10 I would say. She was disoriented (as girls frequently are) and I helped her find directions. I've found that this usually creates an interesting dynamic. You could say you are acting beta in the sense that I made her a favor. But at the same time, it's a small favor where you are an authority, you are showing a masculine quality (spacial intelligence) and she submits to your directions.

I should have made her say thank you though. Success is in small details like this.
At one point she asked me how old I am. I don't remember where I said my real age or some bullshit one, but she told me “I am 17... but I'm legal”. She said her legal tutor (her grandpa), paid for her emancipation. I asked her why she didn't have parents, she said her dad left and her mom died. Game wise I don't think this was bad, but it definitely made me feel sorry for her. And she had a “boyfriend” (in her own terms), . But in hindsight I fucked up. I only grabbed her phone number (and of course she ghosted). I helped her go get fucked by another man. I want to kick myself in the nuts. I should have pull her in another direction. Like “yeah, you probably will get disoriented, let me guide you” And walk towards or nearby an hotel. Then vibe, escalate and say “Hey, I, let's go to a cool place, it has a jacuzzi. We'll be back right away.” According to Gaston the “I'm 17 but legal” was a gigantic IOI. I agree, I completely missed an opportunity. Fuck.

Then we went to a nightclub.

It wasn't good. There weren't many hot girls. And unlike the streets, I had AA. I feel insecure and low status at nightclubs, like I don't have a loud enough voice, I'm not tall enough, I don't know how to dance.
Made a 3 or 4 approaches but they were instant blowouts.
I called it a night but then regreted it. Should have grabbed my balls and approached anyway even though I was feeling like a loser.
Good thing is, I learned how to loosen up and feel more at ease when dancing. This is important, since this translates to body language in general.


April 21st

Approached like 10-15 girls on my way to bus station.

It is so easy to find women to approach in a big city that it got me thinking: Damnn! I need to move to a big city!!! otherwise I'm wasting time!!!

April 22nd

Had approaches opportunities but decided to do ask for the time drill. I also flirted with gym receptionist. I actually regret not approaching. Fuck not approaching man. Fuck trying to be cool.

I always regret not being forward.

Girl I smashed (I still haven't figured out a name for her) responded me. I'm happy. I want to smash her again and again and get sexual experience. Also, she's hot, so I want to take a picture of her body. Gonna pull her to an hotel this week.
Not sure why she didn't responded earlier, since she was very enthusiastic today (I double texted her yesterday) She had issues with conectivity before so maybe she never received my message and it was all in my head.

Random thoughts

I used to be the last person to believe in energy, spirituality, etc. and I still think that 99.999% of “supernatural” things are bullshit. But man, interacting with people is probably the closest thing to “magic” there is. When I was in sales, the day I sold my first car my prospecting was different. People responded way better. If I were more agressive, I could have closed two sales that same day. You could say it was body language, subcomunication, etc. but I think there might be more to it. Who knows.

When approaching you also go through ups and downs. When you feel a certain way, you attract similar things. When you feel high status, you attract high status people. When you feel like a loser, everyone rejects you. When you go out with a wingman, it's easier to boost each other state. You're joking, fucking around, etc. So yesterday we met 2 extremely popular tiktok influencers in the same day. Wtf. Maybe the universe is trying to tell us that tik tok/instagram is the way?

Girls usually ask me if I'm stoned. This can be both good and a bad thing. It's a bad thing because I give an “off” impression. I sometimes lose focus, speak slowly. Many people had told me I'm “slow”. And my eyes. I have heavy eye bags, no matter what I do or how much I sleep (although if I don't sleep they are worse). And I tend to be reactive about it. But I can turn it into a positive. I could say “Why do you ask? Want some? Damn, it seems everybody around here wants to take something from me” or something playful along those lines. I should use make up (I'm trying if self tanning lotion has the same effect) and get an eye laser surgery (I have miopy, which makes me flex my eye muscles too much).

Approach girls like you were going to give them a million dollars. Would you say excuse me? No.
Even better. YOU are a million dollars. You are VALUE. If you're a man, you're value. Masculinity is value, as long as you don't hide it. It's up to you to recognize your value. If you don't value yourself, no one will.

This type of red pill shit gave me hardcore motivation. Knowing that girls lie to nice guys like me and are total sluts with the bad guys touches a very, very deep fiber in me. At the same time, it's easy to fall into resentment, which is a loser's mentality. But that resentment can be sublimated into healthy, masculine aggression that allows to seduce and fuck girls, real hard. Like they want. To stop feeling guilty whenever girls tell me they have a boyfriend. Fuck that. I won't be a clueless chode anymore. Time to be an asshole. An exception is women in traditional marriages with kids. Not gonna ruin that.
But a young girl with a “””boyfriend””””? Fuck that. I'm not missing opportunities just to respect shallow relationships (that sometimes don't even exist).

The level of motivation you get from feeling like CUCK ithat women don't take you seriously while they do fuck other guy is unparallaled. It's like I lost all interest in any hobbies I had. I don't care about art, philosophy, reading books. I only care about being top guy. Banging girls and earning money. Everything in my life serves the purpose of making me a succesful male capable of reproducing and leaving offspring, up in the social hierarchy. Everything else feels irrelevant.

Girls are very manipulative with their crying. I remember when I came to Buenos Aires a couple of months ago, one girl approached me in the street. I saw a girl fighting with her boyfriend earlier and I realized it was her. She told me she was fighting with her boyfriend and she needed a place to sleep, that she came from far away, etc. I was so tempted to be a white knight and “help” her. But something inside me told me not to. Maybe it was fear of fighting her boyfriend.
In hindsight, that girl was trying to manipulate me into being a pawn to cause jealousy in her boyfriend. I'm not saying domestic violence doesn't exist, but I do believe women lie about this a lot of times, and they put themselves into victim positions since they know that's attractive to men and can obtain things from them. Men love to be “saviors”. And a lot of micro situations like that are appearing in my head.

Escalation ideas:
Hold hands, talk about nails. Don't let go.
Body guard routine.
Are you nervous routine.
Kiss on the neck
Massage


Ask their ethnicity

Don't reach out to touch or kiss girls. Make them come to you. In general. Don't reach out. Minimal investment.


Learning how to improvise small talk is so fucking important. Practice practice practice
Make a habit of changing topics, controling silences, conversational threads and inventing pretenses to create plausible deniability. The most basic drill, “asking for the time” entails a fundamental lesson about pretenses.


Act crazy dude. Just act crazy. But calibrated. But dont be average. STAND OUT. Not only in looks but in behavior. Be flexible, loose. Physically and mentally.

Dont have resentment towards women. Dont have "trauma energy". Enjoy femenine energy.

Keep calm in your interactions, try to think, try to watch your sorroundings, what the girl is wearing or doing, to take your time. Don't have an anxious energy. Don't rush.

If you fuck with her, make it clear that you're fucking with her. Sometimes girls are 'too dumb'

Don't be formulaic. Learn to Improvise!!

Extreme gratitude.

It's incredible how much you can learn when you review interactions in your head. And when you have an insight, you review everything that has happened to you in the past and you learn new insights.

Fake it till' you make it.

The world is fake, an illusion. People lie in your face. People tell you “I don't have money”, girls tell you “I have a boyfriend”.Most suckers believe “the story”. But with experience, you see that your competition sold to the same people that rejected you and didn't face the same barrier. If you ask people, they will tell you a story. If you keep asking, they'll keep telling you the same story. They'll never tell you “You are not good looking” or “You are weird/off, you lack social skills”. But your results are enough feedback. It's up to you to take responsability of your (lack of) results.

LAUGH IN THE FACE OF PAIN/ADVERSITY.

PAY MORE ATTENTION TO IOIs AND MOVE FORWARD

HOW BAD DO YOU WANT IT? ARE YOU WILLING TO PAY THE EMOTIONAL PRICE?

ACCEPT LIMITS, ACCEPT THINGS NOT GOING YOUR WAY. ACCEPT NOT BEING 10/10 OR 9 /10 IN PHYSICAL ATTRACTIVENESS


THINK ABOUT YOUR POTENTIAL. NOT YOUR CURRENT STATE
 
tdan187 said:
I think cold approach is pretty impractical.

I'm attracted to it though cause I don't do it and it scares me and intimidates me.

I think it's one thing to have mastered cold approach and then move past it to a higher level. But after having achieved that skill set. But if you aren't at that point I think it would just be an easy excuse to not do it.

It's like anything. You have to put your time in. Once you've done that you can possibly move past it. But you can't escape the work.

I know for me, feeling like I can't approach girls is debilitating and I simply have to confront it. When I can approach hot girls consistently, then I can start thinking I'm too good for it. But until then it needs to be done.
Click to expand...

I used to think the same. That cold approach is a "requisite" for other types of game. You first have to "earn it" through "hard work". It's hard in the beginning, it's a long journey, but if you stick to it, it keeps getting easier, you learn something new everyday!1 It's a linear progression, with each repetition you keep getting better.

It's a very romantic type of thinking. It's also masculine to be attracted to hardship. But the world doesn't necessairly work that way. No one cares about your journey or hard work.

What if there's nothing at the end of the road?

What if, after approaching your first 10k girls, there's nothing but hell for you?

You end up marrying an average or even below average chick, like so many pick up artists and red pill gurus.

Or you marry a hot girl but she holds the power dynamic in the relationship, and all that "game" you learnt was for nothing.

There are many, many ways to fail in this journey. And there are MANY life trajectories that show this. Most people quit in the beginning stages, but a lot of people give up after thousands of approaches.

Also, how many pick up artists/people that approach in general have mental health issues? I remember a significant amount of guys on the gll forums had issues with alcohol, drugs, etc.

Let's be real. All that hard work doesn't come for free. This journey drives many people insane. I recall at least 2 specific 'superstars' that went down the spiritual or religious rabbit hole.

What if you're able to have sex with hundreds of women but can't form an stable relationship and raise a family? Is the journey really worth it?

Is this even healthy?

As you say, cold approach is pretty impractical. For some reason, we've gotten used to shit stats. 1 out of 150-200 means you're disposable. And maybe you have sex with her once and never see her again.

So after a year of facing your fears, being disciplined, consistent, focused... all you get is sex 4-5 times? And most of the girls are average or slightly above average? And the sex isn't really that good since you didnt have time to develop chesmistry with the girl? Or you arent even able to achieve an erection since you only have sex once every two months? Is this really it?

If you want the benefits of overcoming social pressure, you can do other things such as public speaking, street selling, talking to strangers in general, etc.

Of course cold approach is impractical, unless:

-you live in a megacity, meaning you can easily approach 50-100 women daily. And you have good logistics, meaning you're less than 20 min away from pulling venue
-you have socioeconomic leverage. For example, white/western men in Asia or Latin America. It's a cheatcode. You get a favorable smv imbalance without sacrificing the girl's beauty.
-you already have a solid psychological foundation of self esteem, normal affectivity and social skills that allow you to withstand rejection better and have less of it, or avoid brutal rejections entirely.
-you have solid smv and game that allows you to increase your conversion ratios AND retention.

If you can get at least 3-4 hot plates, the 1000 approaches are definitely worth it.

Otherwise, what are you even doing? I ask that to myself too. What do I have to show for my effort?

I used to feel pride about my approaches.

But now I see it as a juvenile position.

Who cares?

I would change 1000 approaches for sex 100 times no doubt.

What if normal people are right? What if the way to go is to get a cute girlfriend, play it safe and get sexual experience+intimacy that makes you psychologically healthier?

What if cold approach is simply weird and alienates most people and the way to go is social circle? What if there's another way, an easier path?

This is not easy for me to confront either. I feel high regret and guilt whenever I don't approach or dont pull the trigger and close the deal.

But maybe it's just an illusion, a need to gain validation and prove that you are a man and have balls.

What if the hard road is not the best one?
 
Im not an expert so I’ll be asking pancakemouse AskTheDom and Manly Cockfellow to support my advise or point out the flaws.

If you let the other dude do all/most of the talking, you are almost always a certified nice guy.

The main point
What are you offering more than the better looking guy?

You can complain all you want that girls choose the hotter guy. Wouldn’t you also choose the hotter girl if 2 girls had the same thing to offer, yet one of them offers better looks?

What makes you standout, why are you worth talking too? Are you funnier than the other guys, do you dress better, are you more ambitious, is there a skill you mastered,…?

I’ll be honest. For short term relationships like hookups or less meaningful relationships fuckbuddies and FWB, looks is the most important factor. But unless you’re an outlier, you will need other stuff.

Right now you’re offering girls that you’re approaching exactly the same as september . Difference is that September (I’m sorry to say it) is more attractive than you.

Make him your competition and figure out ways in which you can better. You are already pretty decent looking. Try to find 2 things you’re really good and confident at and use those. That will make you stand out.
 
How many approaches have you done so far?

I understand your concern and I sympathize with it. I guess it really comes down to how you feel about it. For me, not being able to talk to girls was really frustrating.

This is a frustration that really built up over time and culminated in my approach journey, as I no longer could stand being a bitch. To this day, even if I feel exhausted and like not approaching, if I step outside my place and see a hot girl, my heart accelerates. It tells me I should be doing something.

Not to say I'm never quitting CA, mayhaps if in the future the state of it reaches a point of 1 in 2000 girls then they will be no point to it. The juice won't be worth the squeeze.

Day game is hard. Is the hardest way to get laid out there. Nobody tells you that when you get in, they wanna sell you bs courses, bootcamps, coaching, you name it. Not a coincidence everybody quit it in here either.

It's a hard method, but it's also the most rewarding one. That can be from girls to the confidence, boldness and social freedom. These are important to me.

For me is also the only way to meet women consistenly, pretty much. I don't have and I'm not interested in social circles, I don't like pandering to people or being at places/doing things I don't enjoy. I'm an introvert, I do my thing.

It doesn't help that out there most guys are telling absolute ludicrous stats that makes you wonder what you're doing wrong. There's a lot of lies in this "industry", just forget about what 'other guys' are doing.

I don't think you'd encounter hell if you reach 10k approaches, well if you make it that far, that'd mean you actually came to let go of the initial entitlement of it and move towards the goal of process orientation (a less personal and validation seeking stage).

For gamers who end up with average girls, like take it all with a grain of salt. Many ''cold approachers'' out there are frauds. They don't approach. They do it a bit, quit it, go to tinder and sell your bs courses. The ones who do approach, however, I don't think they're not with hot girls cuz they can't, but rather, as you evolve as a man and discover what are your likes and dislikes, the ''looks'' variable matter less and less. Only when you have abundance is when you can look past the superficial aspect of it, otherwise, 'any' woman is good, since you got none.

Sometimes it's not the hot girls who will give you what you want. And that's very real when it comes to dating dynamics. You think a guy who can approach 50 girls a day really is out there being a bitch in a cucked relationship or some "normal guy" who only got a girl out of luck through some social circle, and has nothing going on for him?

I don't know much experienced you are in the relationships department, but that's something to consider.

Again, I've been there questioning what I was doing as well and if it was worth it. But I believe you'll find your way and will do the right thing, just keep pushing through for now.

Like, if you feel like talking about that stuff, you can hit me up anytime.
 
Sisyphus said:
Approach girls like you were going to give them a million dollars. Would you say excuse me? No.
Even better. YOU are a million dollars. You are VALUE. If you're a man, you're value. Masculinity is value, as long as you don't hide it. It's up to you to recognize your value. If you don't value yourself, no one will.
Click to expand...

Well said
 
kratjeuh
You bring some good points here.

Definitely letting the other guy do most of the work is such a passive position. It sucks to say it but it's the truth.

I'm keeping an eye on september for healthy competition. It doesn't offend me to be part of the 95% of guys that doesn't have model looks lol. As you said it I'm already decent looking so there's no excuse.

What I'm definitely lacking is an edge in my personality. Vibe, body language, energy, whatever you want to call it. I'm too boring, passive, slow, politically correct, stiff and slightly awkward. This is almost as important as looks. It can be improved but at the same time there's no step by step formula, which is why it isn't talked about often. The best cure I guess is going out with wings, or cool people in general.

It's not like I was unable to generate attraction though. I failed to capitalize on it at least two times. So I need to improve my forwardness.

I don't think hobbies or skills matter, but as you say, if someone more experienced wants to jump in, I'd want to hear your thoughts. I mean, they can be potentially useful if you are able to project it.

Ie. It can help in online dating if you have photos doing rock climbing or other sort of activity.

In cold approach, if you can briefly talk about it and subcomunicate you feel confident at it, it can also help. But you could lie about it too so I wouldn't say it's necessary.

It can also help if you want to "build your own castle". If you do x activity, and you are a top dog at it, you hold more value to women involved in that activity/social circle, compared to random women on the streets that don't care.

I also think that not all hobbies are equal. Masculine, outgoing, active hobbies>Neutral/femenine, introverted, intellectual hobbies.

And I think that more than a specific skill, women are attracted to general problem solving skills, ie. Being able to find directions, being able to drive, being able to fix things, showing alertness to potential dangers, maneuvering social situations, leading people, being calm under stress are attractive qualities.

And I agree that showing ambition or a general forward momentum in life is important, even more than having material assets.

Women look for pyschologically healthy (non neurotic, non crazy, with normal emotional circuitry), socially succesful, assertive, dominant men

All of which I'm lacking.

But all of this is shown through action, and it's hard to convey in 10 seconds when you stop strangers on public areas.

Humans existed for the vast majority of their history in small tribes, not huge megacities.

Which is why I think social circle is the real path.

tdan187

I feel you man.

I never considered myself ugly but I often times feel uncool, unmasculine, and less good looking like many other males. Most of us have been there although not everyone has the same cards.

I don't know how much of it is in your head or you are actually ugly.

If I were legitimaly ugly, I wouldnt cold approach at all, or I would move to Nigeria, Thailand, Paraguay or something.

However I would never give up.

The status path is open to everyone. High status ugly guy can outperform good looking loser any day of the week.

If I were 5'5" with ugly face I would become the hardest motherfucker on earth. I'd rather be a drug dealer or have my cam girl agency, or creepy club owner than give up (this is figurative language).

I also feel you on banging subpar chicks. Once I banged girls above a certain level I lost all interest in fucking girls below that level. Or at least in actively pursuing them.

Fuckboy Aspirant

I approached about 800 women (I dont count exactly), with 4 lays, 2 average or below average, one above average and one hot. I actually banged 2, and couldn't actually stick it in on the other ones. But let's say it's 4 for the sake of argument. It's not a bad ratio but it's not good either.

Maybe I could have fucked more. Not a matter of game but simply killer instinct. I remember that in my first 100 approaches often times I wouldn't go for the number. Even now, I wonder what would have happened if I tried to instadate or pull some girls instead of just going for the number.

There are so many factors. I would probably do worse in the US. All of my lays have been with darker skinned girls from poor neighborhoods/living conditions. I'm not saying this to be racist or classist, it's just that being white/middle class is a factor that makes you more valuable. It's the world we live in.

I believe cold approach works better with this type of girls here, while social circle game is the way to go for high status women, roughly speaking. Safety is a concern for women or people in general in Latin American countries and it probably plays a role.

I feel you on wanting to talk to women and overcome your fears. I'm getting over that stage though. In most situations I feel little approach anxiety. I still have approach anxiety in clubs, so that's something to "beat" for me.

I still feel tension in situations like closed environments, public transport, etc.

But I don't care much about it, I'm happy with my current level of social freedom.

You can also challenge your social freedom in so many other ways rather than chasing women.

"For me is also the only way to meet women consistenly, pretty much. I don't have and I'm not interested in social circles, I don't like pandering to people or being at places/doing things I don't enjoy. I'm an introvert, I do my thing."

This I don't agree with. I used to think like this, like many people who get into cold approach. I get where you're coming from and it's respectable.

But,

1) how much are you willing to sacrifice to fuck hot girls? How BAD do you want it?
The more I exhaust all the alternatives, the more I'm like "I don't care if it's weird, ridicoulous or gay, if it helps me fuck hot women, let's do it".
It's like starting a business. If someone tells you, you can earn good money doing something disgusting like cleaning gutters of pest control, would you do it? How important is a high income to you? There's no right or wrong
2) how much of your unwillingness to engage in social situations is due to you legitimately not liking the scene, and not wanting to pander to others, or there are underlying limiting beliefs, self esteem issues and traumatic experiences that make you avoid social situations to protect your ego, reduce the pain and stress of interacting with other people and failing because you aren't skilled at it?

To me, this sounds like "I want abs but I don't want to excercise/diet". Which is why "Game" is so succesful as a marketing product. It's the hack to rewards without actually bringing value to the table.

You could say daygame is hard work, but it's not the right work, the work that society/the world demands or responds to, it's the method that better accomodates to us.

Shortcuts definitely exist but they demand some creativity, thinking outside the box instead of doing the same thing over and over.

Is spending years learning Game, and/or approaching high volume the real shortcut?

Even if you hit the jackpot once in a while, doesn't the house always win?

Who's actually making the bigger investment (in time, energy and money)?

Who's chasing?

Who's most valuable?

Who's in abundance, who's scarce?

Who's setting the frame? Who makes the rules?

Why do we even need a short cut instead of having it in the first place?

Why aren't women already chasing us?
"It's a hard method, but it's also the most rewarding one. That can be from girls to the confidence, boldness and social freedom. These are important to me."

For me they are all rewarding. Confidence, boldness, social freedom, you can have that in social circle and online as well.

"The ones who do approach, however, I don't think they're not with hot girls cuz they can't, but rather, as you evolve as a man and discover what are your likes and dislikes, the ''looks'' variable matter less and less. Only when you have abundance is when you can look past the superficial aspect of it, otherwise, 'any' woman is good, since you got none."

I don't entirely disagree with this, but I feel it's more often than not a cope out. A way to avoid establishing an objective metric for success and competition.

"Looks are subjetive man"
"She might not be hot but hey! She has a good personality!" Well, according to who? isn't personality subjective as well? How can we even know if she has a good personality behind the scenes?

It's a false dichotomy too.

What about girl that are beautiful looking, hot AND have lovely personalities? There are plenty of those.

Also,

A lot of hot women put a "bitchy" front when they dont know you, since they receive a lot of male attention and need to filter out the betas/weak males.

But when she opens up she's femenine and submissive.

Does she really have a bad personality? Or you are too weak/low status or inexperienced and can't see past that front and never get to see women when they're hungry and chasing you?

These posts aren't meant to be negative or pessimistic, I'm just trying to question conventional wisdom
 
Sisyphus said:
I approached about 800 women (I dont count exactly), with 4 lays, 2 average or below average, one above average and one hot. I actually banged 2, and couldn't actually stick it in on the other ones. But let's say it's 4 for the sake of argument. It's not a bad ratio but it's not good either.

Maybe I could have fucked more. Not a matter of game but simply killer instinct. I remember that in my first 100 approaches often times I wouldn't go for the number. Even now, I wonder what would have happened if I tried to instadate or pull some girls instead of just going for the number.

There are so many factors. I would probably do worse in the US. All of my lays have been with darker skinned girls from poor neighborhoods/living conditions. I'm not saying this to be racist or classist, it's just that being white/middle class is a factor that makes you more valuable. It's the world we live in.

I believe cold approach works better with this type of girls here, while social circle game is the way to go for high status women, roughly speaking. Safety is a concern for women or people in general in Latin American countries and it probably plays a role.

I feel you on wanting to talk to women and overcome your fears. I'm getting over that stage though. In most situations I feel little approach anxiety. I still have approach anxiety in clubs, so that's something to "beat" for me.

I still feel tension in situations like closed environments, public transport, etc.

But I don't care much about it, I'm happy with my current level of social freedom.

You can also challenge your social freedom in so many other ways rather than chasing women.
Click to expand...

That's a regular ratio, but also you just don't have enough data. Yeah, 800 is a lot for most guys but on a macro you have to understand it's not "ok I'll hit on 800 chicks and I'm garanteed to bang 2. Yes and no, you can go through a dry spell of 1000, god even 2000 if unlucky and get 0. Then followed by a 100 approaches where you get 6 dates and you pull 5. On a macro, it evens out. It's the numbers game.

Like you said yourself and I agree with you, in the first 1000 approaches you're pretty much just learning how to play, you're not forward enough and can't capitalize opportunities. I consider this as redshirt year, as per the article by GLL. So after sometime I had no worries concerning ratios, I was just learning.

On that aspect of the girls appearance, coming from a latin american country as well I understand it, and it was definitely something I had in my mind prior to this. However what I can say is that if there's one thing CA taught is that I can never judge a book by its cover.

I've came to see that that doesn't seem to be exactly pattern of this, ugly/hot, white/black, you name it. Couldn't find specifically any link, at least when it comes to CA. They ghost and reject just the same, hence why I strongly believe now it's mostly female nature, and that has no race or whatsoever.

I'm not white, but I've been to dates with white girls, black girls, even natives. Sometimes you yourself are putting in these limiting beliefs and in turn this is reflected on your behavior whilst approaching (avoiding x type of girls, and things of the sort). Again, if that's the case, I sympathize and I've done that myself, but that's just not reality.

Like, it's really up to you. If you feel like you've "grown" out of approaching, more power to you. It's not really mandatory and if you feel like this is draining your energy and making you depressed, yeah, you don't have to keep it going.

What I can't do is just come here and say "yeah, you're justified, approaching is a waste of time and doesn't work, just go do social circle instead". It's really up to you.

Sisyphus said:
1) how much are you willing to sacrifice to fuck hot girls? How BAD do you want it?
The more I exhaust all the alternatives, the more I'm like "I don't care if it's weird, ridicoulous or gay, if it helps me fuck hot women, let's do it".
It's like starting a business. If someone tells you, you can earn good money doing something disgusting like cleaning gutters of pest control, would you do it? How important is a high income to you? There's no right or wrong
2) how much of your unwillingness to engage in social situations is due to you legitimately not liking the scene, and not wanting to pander to others, or there are underlying limiting beliefs, self esteem issues and traumatic experiences that make you avoid social situations to protect your ego, reduce the pain and stress of interacting with other people and failing because you aren't skilled at it?
Click to expand...

The reason I say I don't want the social circle thing is simply because I did it myself. It's not like I just decided it wasn't for me before trying. Personally, I didn't find it easier, but it might very well be because I'm not suited for it. It can happen. It didn't empowered me, I didn't enjoy it. It did nothing for me.

I didn't find it a good way to spend my energy, perhaps if I were someone who's naturally some 'people magnet' type, potentially it could have been different.

People want shortcuts and cheatcodes, I'm afraid you won't find it to be one either, but I could be wrong. It's not a matter of being wrong or right. In this case, it wasn't for me. This is not to say I don't have a social circle or that I avoid people. I do have my circle, I like to be around people I enjoy being around.

I think its a valid question, but honestly I don't see how doing something virtually nobody does, incurring incessant rejection and public embarassment like it is with CA, could be a way of dealing with the fear of those same things I just mentioned. It depends on the person, but I find it way easier to simply do the regular thing that everybody does and hope it works instead of going out of your way to be "weird" chasing something you really want.

Likewise, you understand I can simply flip these questions to you regarding CA as well, and it will be just as valid, right?

Sisyphus said:
To me, this sounds like "I want abs but I don't want to excercise/diet". Which is why "Game" is so succesful as a marketing product. It's the hack to rewards without actually bringing value to the table.

You could say daygame is hard work, but it's not the right work, the work that society/the world demands or responds to, it's the method that better accomodates to us.

Shortcuts definitely exist but they demand some creativity, thinking outside the box instead of doing the same thing over and over.

Is spending years learning Game, and/or approaching high volume the real shortcut?
Click to expand...
I really don't see the connection here. Yeah, maybe if by game you mean tricks, gimmicks and stuff like that, then yeah. But I talk about CA. And there's really no BS to CA, it's a numbers game. You must hit the numbers to achieve the results, that's it. The hard work is going out there and facing your rejection mileage in order to reach the positive outcome.

On that society thing, I'm sorry. I find this pathetic. If we were to go full "blackpill" on this, I guess you already know, but: society doesn't even want you to get laid. Society wants you to stay quiet, be a good slave and work until you die.

It's not a coincidence things get exponentially hard for males as time goes by. Society is trying to cuck you.

Sisyphus said:
For me they are all rewarding. Confidence, boldness, social freedom, you can have that in social circle and online as well.
Click to expand...

I don't agree with this at all. I can tell you, all the matches I've had online didn't do 1% of what going out of my way, getting rejected plenty of times and having to face not only the rejections but lack of results for months did for my confidence and social freedom. It's just not comparable.

Again, this is really something that makes evident people who approach and who don't. There's people out there (even here) who get laid a lot through OLD or social circle, but are needy and fear rejection a lot. I just don't see how these things are equal by any means.

Sisyphus said:
I don't entirely disagree with this, but I feel it's more often than not a cope out. A way to avoid establishing an objective metric for success and competition.

"Looks are subjetive man"
"She might not be hot but hey! She has a good personality!" Well, according to who? isn't personality subjective as well? How can we even know if she has a good personality behind the scenes?

It's a false dichotomy too.

What about girl that are beautiful looking, hot AND have lovely personalities? There are plenty of those.
Click to expand...

Not quite sure on how to answer that. What I can say is that 1: I don't approach girls I don't find attractive. Not to say I only hit on 10/10 chicks, but I'm not hitting on ugly girls either. I have my threshold of attraction and I'm okay with that.

and 2: I don't put hot girls on a pedestal. When you face enough rejections, naturally there's a tendency, I've noticed, to really not care about how you present yourself and not changing your behavior to please anyone. Hot and ugly girls will reject anyways, regardless. This behavior really can't be faked.

Sisyphus said:
A lot of hot women put a "bitchy" front when they dont know you, since they receive a lot of male attention and need to filter out the betas/weak males.

But when she opens up she's femenine and submissive.

Does she really have a bad personality? Or you are too weak/low status or inexperienced and can't see past that front and never get to see women when they're hungry and chasing you?

These posts aren't meant to be negative or pessimistic, I'm just trying to question conventional wisdom
Click to expand...

Like I said, I'll approach regardless. I really don't like to judge a book by it's cover like I said, and I think that applies to that as well. Whether she looks bitchy or not, we'll see how she is once you're actually on a date with her and is being forward enough. Personally, I don't think all women are submissive and feminine just like not all men are masculine and dominant. In fact very few do. It's just people individuality. I don't think every single woman is "submissive" with the right guy. Some girls just aren't at all. And if she is and that guy is not you and you're not okay with that, good bye to her. That's how I see it.

To be quite frank, I've found this post a little bit whiny and needy/validation-seeking in some aspects.

We can spend all day talking about why women have it easier and all that. What's the point? Life's not fair, but it's not only unfairness. There's always something you can do.

Like, why do you care so much about girls "chasing" you? If you want the hot girls so badly, who cares? I also find the whole "shortcut" seeking thing as a way to avoid rejection, I might be wrong, but that's what I got from it.
 
Fuckboy Aspirant said:
That's a regular ratio, but also you just don't have enough data. Yeah, 800 is a lot for most guys but on a macro you have to understand it's not "ok I'll hit on 800 chicks and I'm garanteed to bang 2. Yes and no, you can go through a dry spell of 1000, god even 2000 if unlucky and get 0. Then followed by a 100 approaches where you get 6 dates and you pull 5. On a macro, it evens out. It's the numbers game.

Like you said yourself and I agree with you, in the first 1000 approaches you're pretty much just learning how to play, you're not forward enough and can't capitalize opportunities. I consider this as redshirt year, as per the article by GLL. So after sometime I had no worries concerning ratios, I was just learning.

On that aspect of the girls appearance, coming from a latin american country as well I understand it, and it was definitely something I had in my mind prior to this. However what I can say is that if there's one thing CA taught is that I can never judge a book by its cover.

I've came to see that that doesn't seem to be exactly pattern of this, ugly/hot, white/black, you name it. Couldn't find specifically any link, at least when it comes to CA. They ghost and reject just the same, hence why I strongly believe now it's mostly female nature, and that has no race or whatsoever.

I'm not white, but I've been to dates with white girls, black girls, even natives. Sometimes you yourself are putting in these limiting beliefs and in turn this is reflected on your behavior whilst approaching (avoiding x type of girls, and things of the sort). Again, if that's the case, I sympathize and I've done that myself, but that's just not reality.
Click to expand...

I agree. I'm jumping to conclusions here. I don't think it's the absolute truth, I'm speculating, we all have a tendency to create imaginary patterns. I agree that it's small sample size.

At the same time, I also think there isn't enough evidence to say that cold approach is a 'pure numbers game' and looks, social skills and other factors don't matter, even though some people in the community swear by it.

Fuckboy Aspirant said:
Like, it's really up to you. If you feel like you've "grown" out of approaching, more power to you. It's not really mandatory and if you feel like this is draining your energy and making you depressed, yeah, you don't have to keep it going.

What I can't do is just come here and say "yeah, you're justified, approaching is a waste of time and doesn't work, just go do social circle instead". It's really up to you.
Click to expand...

I don't feel I've grown out of approaching, nor I ever will. I think my desire to approach will always be there.

What I do think is that it has become my new comfort zone. The only things I can do to grow are:

-approach higher volume. this is hard to do in a 120k town. So it's more like, I've decided focusing on daygame is inefficient until I can move to a big city. So I'm focusing on money for the next months.

-Improve my game and force myself to do things I'm uncomfortable. Meaning, improve my body language, my vibe, the way I talk, the words I use, learn to tease, sexualize, to overcome objections, change topics, lead the interaction verbally, physically and logistically, learn to escalate in a calibrated way.

I think daygame is not the best way to learn this. Which doesn't mean I think daygame isn't a good place to implement game once you learn it.

The best way to learn this is social circle, in my opinion. Why? Because you get to test things over and over until you figure it out. Why? because you are in a position where girls approach you, not the other way around, You get to see girls when they are default receptive, not default unreceptive. If you fuck up, you can easily try again.

In cold approach, you get rejected instantly most of the time, and you don't know whether you did something wrong or you would have gotten rejected regardless, and you don't know what you did wrong. You've too little exposition. You may approach hundreds of girls but you only interact with most of them for 5 seconds and that's it.

If you are an alpha male in a social circle, you also get validation, positive feedback that reinforces your identity as a valuable man that women fight for. And this is the position where all the 'game' techniques naturally stem out from.

The only way to learn game through cold approach is to go out with a cool guy/experienced wing. Which is something I also can't do until I move to a big city.

If you go out by yourself and don't have some natural predisposition, you may aswell do 10000 of approaches and never 'get it'. All while you keep reinforcing the frame of being an scarce guy that chases women on the street.

I have mixed feelings with cold approach. Sometimes I love the fuck of it, sometimes I feel weird. Sometimes I find it monotonous. But I'm not attached to it as a way to meet women.

I do resent the fact that you fight your fears and all that. But maybe it takes 5000 approaches to plate a hot girl? All while average cuck easily plates hot girl just for being part of her social circle.

So it's not about me whining and refusing to face pain or discomfort. But rather, is this the product I want? Do I really care if my lays are from cold approach or they are online? Do I care about laycount? Or I would rather have 2-3 hot regular fuckbuddies?

Is this the only way to get what I want?
What price am I willing to pay?
Would I rather roam the streets and get incessantly rejected?
Or do I prefer to work my way up the social ladder? Or change my sleep schedule to go out everyday to nightclubs and get drunk? Do I care about doing drugs if that increases my chance of fucking hot chicks? What if I actually enjoy the party lifestyle at this time of my life?

So I'm not anti cold approach at all, but why exclusively cold approach? Why don't add something else?

Fuckboy Aspirant said:
The reason I say I don't want the social circle thing is simply because I did it myself. It's not like I just decided it wasn't for me before trying. Personally, I didn't find it easier, but it might very well be because I'm not suited for it. It can happen. It didn't empowered me, I didn't enjoy it. It did nothing for me.

I didn't find it a good way to spend my energy, perhaps if I were someone who's naturally some 'people magnet' type, potentially it could have been different.
Click to expand...

There are so many ways social circle can unfold that it's hard to discuss or measure. But do you mean by it? Going to some activity and befriending people there and waiting for some sort of signal and then make a move on one girl?

I mean actually climbing up the social ladder. Competing against other guys to be an alpha male. Or cooperating with other males or people in general and building something of value in an environment that women congregate to.

I mean actually being in a leadership position, or at least a position with some responsibility and social visibility. For example, working as a bartender, bouncer, club promoter, or hosting events or parties. Being a teacher/instructor, a lifeguard. Even something simple like driving an Uber.

Or being an artist/musician/performer/comedian and performing in front of an audience.

Or becoming big on social media.

By social circle I mean creating preselection, social proof, being in the center of attention and performing in a way that shows skill/know-how/capability/leadership/confidence.

This is definitely not what most people do (although it's what succesful naturals do).


Fuckboy Aspirant said:
Likewise, you understand I can simply flip these questions to you regarding CA as well, and it will be just as valid, right?
Click to expand...

Yeah, but I think that after getting close to 1000 approaches I've earnt my right to question it without feeling that I'm trying to avoid discomfort. I know I can do it and keep doing it.

Fuckboy Aspirant said:
I really don't see the connection here. Yeah, maybe if by game you mean tricks, gimmicks and stuff like that, then yeah. But I talk about CA. And there's really no BS to CA, it's a numbers game. You must hit the numbers to achieve the results, that's it. The hard work is going out there and facing your rejection mileage in order to reach the positive outcome.

On that society thing, I'm sorry. I find this pathetic. If we were to go full "blackpill" on this, I guess you already know, but: society doesn't even want you to get laid. Society wants you to stay quiet, be a good slave and work until you die.

It's not a coincidence things get exponentially hard for males as time goes by. Society is trying to cuck you.
Click to expand...

The shortcut is that by cold approaching you're bypassing certain rules that typically mediate social interactions. We get to do that since we now live in huge cities with millions of people, while before we lived in small communities where everyone knew each other.

I think that society doesn't care about you getting laid with multiple women, but I don't think it actively works against you. I think hypergamy exists. And women are universally attracted to a % of guys that have certain qualities, that are alpha males. So women only want you to get laid if you're an alpha guy, and also don't want to test if you're an alpha guy or not and prefer to not risk fucking a guy that they aren't sure about.

This is getting too theoretical, but society in general prefers you to be monogamous rather than polygamous, yeah. If few alpha males get all the girls, the rest of beta males will be angry and destabilize society. We know the story.

But it's also what happened during most of history. Emperors, kings, powerful men in general, having multiple wives or concubines or what not.

If you add enough value to the world, society will be ok with you concentrating all the women and all the resources.

There's a difference between passively submitting to society vs engaging with reality, understand how people work, understanding the rules of the game and playing by the rules to get what you want.

Most humans have an "in-crowd" bias and distrust strangers or outsiders. Most people also submit to authority figures that are socially proofed, and reject people that seem to not have authority/social proof.

Fuckboy Aspirant said:
I don't agree with this at all. I can tell you, all the matches I've had online didn't do 1% of what going out of my way, getting rejected plenty of times and having to face not only the rejections but lack of results for months did for my confidence and social freedom. It's just not comparable.

Again, this is really something that makes evident people who approach and who don't. There's people out there (even here) who get laid a lot through OLD or social circle, but are needy and fear rejection a lot. I just don't see how these things are equal by any means.
Click to expand...

I think one thing is not fear rejection and another one is actively seeking it. Avoiding any kind of rejection is needy, but trying to maximize receptivity is a logical, natural and winning mindset. In what world facing lack of results is a good thing? Maybe in the beginning stages facing that adversity grows a thick skin in you. But it's a transitional stage, to get to something better. Wanting to forever be "on the grind" seems masochistic. If anything, you get into another type of grind and face another type of adversity.

To me actively seeking rejection doesn't seem like a winner mindset. A winner, alpha guy, doesn't care about rejection at all, it doesn't exist. He does everything to get results no matter what he has to do. He achieves outcomes by any means necessary. Does it take 10000 approaches to plate 3 hot girls? Cool. Does he plate 3 hot girls by growing an instagram account? Cool too. He doesn't care about not facing rejection since rejection doesn't exist in the first place, or is irrelevant and his self esteem remains unaffected.

Fuckboy Aspirant said:
Not quite sure on how to answer that. What I can say is that 1: I don't approach girls I don't find attractive. Not to say I only hit on 10/10 chicks, but I'm not hitting on ugly girls either. I have my threshold of attraction and I'm okay with that.

and 2: I don't put hot girls on a pedestal. When you face enough rejections, naturally there's a tendency, I've noticed, to really not care about how you present yourself and not changing your behavior to please anyone. Hot and ugly girls will reject anyways, regardless. This behavior really can't be faked.
Click to expand...

Well, I said that since you said that as you evolve, looks become a less important factor and if "advanced" guys marry average girls, it's because they value less looks and more other aspects of personality. Am I correct?

I don't think looks will ever become unimportant to me. While not sufficient, I think looks are definitely a necessary condition. And I think a lot of times people use the "personality card" as a way to compensate for lack of looks. Both ugly women and men that are with ugly women.

I don't put hot girls on a pedestal but I want to fuck them. I don't care about pleasing them, but I do care about behaving in a way that is conducive to fucking them. Most often than not trying to please them is counter productive. But I don't think you can say anything you want and have to calibrate.

I do things that I'll probably don't do otherwise like using a self tanning lotion, or wear insoles, only to increase my chances with hot girls. Does that make me people pleasing?




Fuckboy Aspirant said:
To be quite frank, I've found this post a little bit whiny and needy/validation-seeking in some aspects.

We can spend all day talking about why women have it easier and all that. What's the point? Life's not fair, but it's not only unfairness. There's always something you can do.

Like, why do you care so much about girls "chasing" you? If you want the hot girls so badly, who cares? I also find the whole "shortcut" seeking thing as a way to avoid rejection, I might be wrong, but that's what I got from it.
Click to expand...

Is it validation seeking to want girls to chase you? If I want to fuck girls, what's the easier scenario? the one where I'm chasing or the one I'm being chased?

Is it validation seeking to want girls to tell you you're attractive and they desperately want your dick inside them?

Maybe.

But there's some validation component to all of this journey, and to a certain extent it's healthy to want that. Gll talks about this, you need to fuck hot girls to get that shit out of your system and then stop needing that validation.

I will stop posting so much though. I'll actually walk the talk and come in a few months and tell y'all how I've been doing.
 
Sisyphus said:
tdan187 said:
I think cold approach is pretty impractical.

I'm attracted to it though cause I don't do it and it scares me and intimidates me.

I think it's one thing to have mastered cold approach and then move past it to a higher level. But after having achieved that skill set. But if you aren't at that point I think it would just be an easy excuse to not do it.

It's like anything. You have to put your time in. Once you've done that you can possibly move past it. But you can't escape the work.

I know for me, feeling like I can't approach girls is debilitating and I simply have to confront it. When I can approach hot girls consistently, then I can start thinking I'm too good for it. But until then it needs to be done.
Click to expand...

I used to think the same. That cold approach is a "requisite" for other types of game. You first have to "earn it" through "hard work". It's hard in the beginning, it's a long journey, but if you stick to it, it keeps getting easier, you learn something new everyday!1 It's a linear progression, with each repetition you keep getting better.

It's a very romantic type of thinking. It's also masculine to be attracted to hardship. But the world doesn't necessairly work that way. No one cares about your journey or hard work.

What if there's nothing at the end of the road?

What if, after approaching your first 10k girls, there's nothing but hell for you?

You end up marrying an average or even below average chick, like so many pick up artists and red pill gurus.

Or you marry a hot girl but she holds the power dynamic in the relationship, and all that "game" you learnt was for nothing.

There are many, many ways to fail in this journey. And there are MANY life trajectories that show this. Most people quit in the beginning stages, but a lot of people give up after thousands of approaches.

Also, how many pick up artists/people that approach in general have mental health issues? I remember a significant amount of guys on the gll forums had issues with alcohol, drugs, etc.

Let's be real. All that hard work doesn't come for free. This journey drives many people insane. I recall at least 2 specific 'superstars' that went down the spiritual or religious rabbit hole.

What if you're able to have sex with hundreds of women but can't form an stable relationship and raise a family? Is the journey really worth it?

Is this even healthy?

As you say, cold approach is pretty impractical. For some reason, we've gotten used to shit stats. 1 out of 150-200 means you're disposable. And maybe you have sex with her once and never see her again.

So after a year of facing your fears, being disciplined, consistent, focused... all you get is sex 4-5 times? And most of the girls are average or slightly above average? And the sex isn't really that good since you didnt have time to develop chesmistry with the girl? Or you arent even able to achieve an erection since you only have sex once every two months? Is this really it?

If you want the benefits of overcoming social pressure, you can do other things such as public speaking, street selling, talking to strangers in general, etc.

Of course cold approach is impractical, unless:

-you live in a megacity, meaning you can easily approach 50-100 women daily. And you have good logistics, meaning you're less than 20 min away from pulling venue
-you have socioeconomic leverage. For example, white/western men in Asia or Latin America. It's a cheatcode. You get a favorable smv imbalance without sacrificing the girl's beauty.
-you already have a solid psychological foundation of self esteem, normal affectivity and social skills that allow you to withstand rejection better and have less of it, or avoid brutal rejections entirely.
-you have solid smv and game that allows you to increase your conversion ratios AND retention.

If you can get at least 3-4 hot plates, the 1000 approaches are definitely worth it.

Otherwise, what are you even doing? I ask that to myself too. What do I have to show for my effort?

I used to feel pride about my approaches.

But now I see it as a juvenile position.

Who cares?

I would change 1000 approaches for sex 100 times no doubt.

What if normal people are right? What if the way to go is to get a cute girlfriend, play it safe and get sexual experience+intimacy that makes you psychologically healthier?

What if cold approach is simply weird and alienates most people and the way to go is social circle? What if there's another way, an easier path?

This is not easy for me to confront either. I feel high regret and guilt whenever I don't approach or dont pull the trigger and close the deal.

But maybe it's just an illusion, a need to gain validation and prove that you are a man and have balls.

What if the hard road is not the best one?
Click to expand...

If a guy gets nothing after approaching 10k girls, as you theorise, then there is something seriously wrong with him, either in terms of looks (facial deformity, terrible grooming, shorter than 5'3 etc) or hygiene-wise, or something incredibly off with his vibe. Cold approach daygame is hard but it's not supposed to be THAT hard

Most guys if they're able to socialise normally and aren't really ugly should get 1 / 100 approach to lay, if not better
 
Sonofagun

I didn't mean that you get 0 lays after 10000 approaches, although there are people that get nothing for their first 2000.

What I do think happens is, you approach 10000, which is something insanely difficult to do, probably it's something that 99,99% of the population can't and isn't willing to do, requires a significant amount of energy, will power and time.

What I say is, after all that effort, you may still remain in scarcity and never actually develop an alpha frame.

You may never actually solve deeper issues like past trauma, being socially weird, etc.

You're simply a hard-ass that went through the trouble of talking every girl in town. Cool. Congrats.

You still need to invest massive amounts of time and energy if you want newer leads. Otherwise you're back at square one.

All while you keep getting older, you get a receding hairline, lower testosterone and sex drive, you want to focus more time on your business or work. So the most practical thing is to get into a LTR.

You may go through 10k approaches and never actually learn game, even if you get some results through sheer numbers game. If you didn't learn game, you have almost the same chance of having a shitty relationship where you become beta as a guy that never did a single approach.

Maybe that time and effort would've been better spent building your own thing that gives you fame, status, preselection etc.

Maybe it's even more productive to get on a few LTRs that you go through with a red-pill-aware mindset, where you get more sexual experience and relationship experience than you get doing those 10k approaches.

How many PUAs there are out there that remain forever socially weird? Maybe most of them?

How many of them get into LTRs, maybe even with 10/10 girls, but become huge simps?

Have you ever read The Game? What about Mystery being suicidal over one girl?

How many PUAs become Red Pill Talibans? I'm thinking Roosh V, etc.

Is this really what winning in life is?

All I'm saying is, daygame, doing lots of approaches, etc. doesn't guarantee anything, even if it takes massive amounts of dedication.
 
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